zanydoodles (9:10:55 PM): I LIVE
renayorama (9:11:03 PM): OH MY GOD YAY YOU'RE BACK JOY
zanydoodles (9:11:16 PM): NOT FOR LONG, BUT I LIVE.MUST SHOWER LIEK WHOA
renayorama (9:11:55 PM): BUT THEN YOU WILL RETURN?
zanydoodles (9:12:05 PM): I THINK SO
zanydoodles (9:12:32 PM): PS: THINGS THAT ARE MADE OF WIN AND WIN INCLUDE THE FOLLOWING:
zanydoodles (9:12:34 PM): Five ('Absolutely Inappropiate and Completely False!'Steiner yells. 'Stop That At Once!',) Rumors that Circulated Through the Pluto Knights about Steiner and Beatrix
renayorama (9:12:59 PM): XD
zanydoodles (9:13:05 PM): THESE I MUST SEE. I DEMAND STEINER/BEATRIX RUMOURS.
renayorama (9:13:18 PM): Meg will write them soon!
zanydoodles (9:13:25 PM): GOOD.
zanydoodles (9:13:33 PM): Tell Meg she is my personal hero.
renayorama (9:13:37 PM): xD
zanydoodles (9:13:41 PM): Steiner is made of MUCH LOVE.
zanydoodles (9:13:52 PM): ALMOST AS MUCH LOVE AS ZIDANE.
renayorama (9:13:58 PM): He definitely is
renayorama (9:14:00 PM): I love him.
zanydoodles (9:14:28 PM): I adore Steiner. I think he and Vivi tie for my favourite-characer-other-than-Zidane.
renayorama (9:14:44 PM): But what of Amarant and his GAY STALKING?
zanydoodles (9:14:45 PM): Amarant is HOTTEST for me, but those two are my favourites. Besides Zidane.
zanydoodles (9:14:56 PM): There is a difference between HOT and OMG I LOVE.
renayorama (9:15:17 PM): :-D
zanydoodles (9:15:28 PM): nah, I love Amarant lots because he is very hot and very gay. But Vivi and Steiner win for charm and--
zanydoodles (9:15:28 PM): and--
zanydoodles (9:15:32 PM): AWESOME.
renayorama (9:15:44 PM): I need to play! SOON I WILL.
zanydoodles (9:15:53 PM): YES. YOU HAVE GAME IN HAND.
zanydoodles (9:15:59 PM): I think I included a message >.>
renayorama (9:16:30 PM): YOU DID, I LOL'ED
renayorama (9:16:39 PM): The mail guy was o_O
zanydoodles (9:16:47 PM): XDDD
zanydoodles (9:17:03 PM): I felt it was appropriate.
zanydoodles (9:17:11 PM): ANYWAY. SHOWER.
renayorama (9:17:14 PM): OKAY
zanydoodles (9:17:34 PM): ps: no reply to my email ;____________________;
renayorama (9:17:51 PM): I haven't checked my e-mail today!
zanydoodles (9:17:53 PM): I felt ABANDONED all day ;______________;
renayorama (9:17:54 PM): I AM SORRY
zanydoodles (9:18:00 PM): YOU SHOULD BE.
renayorama (9:18:05 PM): I didn't get up until like 5. xD
zanydoodles (9:18:12 PM): oh right!
zanydoodles (9:18:17 PM): no school anymore, right?
renayorama (9:18:20 PM): Nope.
zanydoodles (9:18:30 PM): LUCKY HOBAG. I hope you're enjoying the break!
renayorama (9:18:35 PM): I AM.
renayorama (9:18:37 PM): SHOWER!
zanydoodles (9:18:42 PM): EMAIL ME BACK.
renayorama (9:18:50 PM): OKAY?
zanydoodles (9:19:00 PM): I shower, you check email. Gotcha. GOODBYE.
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zanydoodles (11:46:38 PM): hey, I'm actually about to drop off to bed, but I thought I'd at least say hi
renayorama (11:46:54 PM): Oh! Hi!

Auto Response from zanydoodles (11:46:53 PM): SLEEP
zanydoodles (11:46:56 PM): and also ask about Regann. Did you reply to her? I hope everything's okay?
renayorama (11:47:09 PM): No, I haven't replied yet
renayorama (11:47:21 PM): And yeah; things are okay!
zanydoodles (11:48:09 PM): well, I hope you two sort it out. the situation has thoroughly confused me. good luck, and let me know how it goes? I'm about to drop dead over here
renayorama (11:48:34 PM): Okay!
renayorama (11:48:37 PM): GET SOME REST.
zanydoodles (11:48:54 PM): yes, yes =P
zanydoodles (11:48:58 PM): good night!
renayorama (11:49:00 PM): Night!
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zanydoodles (11:49:00 PM): Jesus christ, Nay, ever since I came home, every day I've been up till around midnight DOING STUFF. and none of it fandom-related or even online, barring online college application stuff, banking, etc.
zanydoodles (11:49:04 PM): HOW LAME IS THAT.
renayorama (11:49:31 PM): >.>
renayorama (11:49:33 PM): Uh
renayorama (11:49:36 PM): What have you been doing?
zanydoodles (11:51:29 PM): talking to Travis and my parents, mostly, when I'm not sorting through various other things in life that need attention. financial files, getting reimbursements for medical stuff now that I finally have my insurance card, arranging college stuff, trying to line up a subletter for the apartment, getting things ready on this end for Travis, including housing for him and the cats, a job for him, transportation, wedding plans
zanydoodles (11:51:31 PM): STUFF.
zanydoodles (11:52:32 PM): and, as I said, talkign to Travis and my parents about all of the above and more.
zanydoodles (11:52:34 PM): LAME.
renayorama (11:53:46 PM): Busy busy!
zanydoodles (11:54:02 PM): yep
zanydoodles (11:54:05 PM): and you?
renayorama (11:54:07 PM): ...
renayorama (11:54:11 PM): nothing
renayorama (11:54:14 PM): >.>
zanydoodles (11:54:15 PM): get my last email?
renayorama (11:54:29 PM): maybe, gmail is being an ass
zanydoodles (11:54:41 PM): (I envy you, but at the same time I suck at having nothing to do, so I guess yhis is actually better for me, really)
zanydoodles (11:55:08 PM): oh. Uh. it had a long awkward pause in the middle of the emal. I'm sure you'd remember it =P
renayorama (11:55:09 PM): but!!
renayorama (11:55:21 PM): withdrawal!
zanydoodles (11:55:54 PM): I'LL BE BACK I PROMISE. and at least now I am talking to you again!
renayorama (11:56:19 PM): I KNOW
renayorama (11:56:34 PM): TANTALIZING GLIMPSES
renayorama (11:56:58 PM): And gmail worrking against me so I can't log in1
zanydoodles (11:57:19 PM): whore!
zanydoodles (11:57:23 PM): uh
zanydoodles (11:57:28 PM): I can cp my email here? >.>
renayorama (11:58:34 PM): Wow. Uh
renayorama (11:58:39 PM): Was there BAD NEWS in it? >.>
zanydoodles (11:58:49 PM): ...no?
renayorama (11:59:01 PM): Oh.
renayorama (11:59:02 PM): Uh
renayorama (11:59:04 PM): XD@
zanydoodles (11:59:09 PM): you just seemed frustreated with gmail
renayorama (11:59:32 PM): I am, my manager tells me I have mail, but when I click to go, it just takes me to the log in screen
renayorama (11:59:37 PM): Hrm!
renayorama (11:59:42 PM): LOG IN MANUALLY.
renayorama (11:59:52 PM): I'm a retard
zanydoodles (12:00:15 AM): ... uh
zanydoodles (12:00:24 AM): okay, I'll pretend I understood the problem!
renayorama (12:00:24 AM): Ha ha ha
renayorama (12:00:30 AM): I think it's the plugin
renayorama (12:00:34 AM): Silly firefox
renayorama (12:00:46 AM): You want me to review your work? xD
zanydoodles (12:01:00 AM): ...
zanydoodles (12:01:01 AM): >.>
zanydoodles (12:01:02 AM): <.<
zanydoodles (12:01:15 AM): you know I am sexually stimulated by feedback, yes?
renayorama (12:01:20 AM): And all my reviews are here: http://community.livejournal.com/1000_needles
zanydoodles (12:01:20 AM): oh baby crit me harder?
renayorama (12:01:24 AM): But they're locked right now.
zanydoodles (12:02:53 AM): I see my talk about my kinky literary fantasies has stopped conversation dead.
zanydoodles (12:05:20 AM): ... quite dead indeed.
zanydoodles (12:05:26 AM): I see.
renayorama (12:05:31 AM): NO
renayorama (12:05:35 AM): No, I was just.
zanydoodles (12:05:42 AM): balking in horror? XD
renayorama (12:05:45 AM): AROUSED. I HAD TO TAKE A COLD SHOWER.
zanydoodles (12:05:50 AM): XDDDD
zanydoodles (12:05:54 AM): WHAT THE HELL BY XDDD
renayorama (12:06:01 AM): *snicker*
zanydoodles (12:07:35 AM): anyway, uh
zanydoodles (12:07:37 AM): yeah
zanydoodles (12:07:49 AM): all joking aside, I'd love some good, hard reviewing
renayorama (12:08:03 AM): I'm not exactly sure I'm HARD about it?
zanydoodles (12:08:27 AM): at the time you read my fics, you were not only not into reviewing/feedback, but not into reading fics, even. so, uh. I've tried not to ask since I discovered that I was going horribly against your current wants at the time >.>
zanydoodles (12:08:39 AM): oh, hard isn't necessary or anything. I just like feedback.
zanydoodles (12:08:57 AM): I'm just not-so-secretly a masochist on top of that. you don't mhave to indulge that XD
renayorama (12:09:00 AM): I figure I'll do groups of fic, to keep fandoms together or whatever.
renayorama (12:09:04 AM): So sure!
renayorama (12:09:48 AM): One day I'll even make them, like, public, maybe. >.>
zanydoodles (12:10:11 AM): ... do I get to see mine if/when you do it? >.>
renayorama (12:11:01 AM): If you're a member of the community? xD
renayorama (12:11:08 AM): Or I'll just paste them, I guess. xD
zanydoodles (12:11:35 AM): ...
zanydoodles (12:11:56 AM): but 1000needles isn't a community! D=
zanydoodles (12:12:03 AM): I know, cause I JUST TRIED TO JOIN
zanydoodles (12:12:27 AM): ...maybe you gave me the wrong user name?
zanydoodles (12:12:42 AM): 1000_needles? 1000needles? something else? halp?
zanydoodles (12:12:54 AM): I do want to see what the reviews look like, though!
zanydoodles (12:13:06 AM): (also I should go to bed soon)
zanydoodles (12:13:46 AM): AHA!
zanydoodles (12:13:51 AM): sneaky you!
zanydoodles (12:13:57 AM): trying to throw me off the trail!
renayorama (12:13:59 AM): Oh, maybe
zanydoodles (12:14:04 AM): I put in the extra 0 you left out of the link.
renayorama (12:14:08 AM): It's the multiple zeros
zanydoodles (12:14:08 AM): found it.
renayorama (12:14:10 AM): XD
renayorama (12:14:11 AM): Yeah
zanydoodles (12:15:00 AM): oh dear, did I make you epithet-sensitive? >.>
renayorama (12:15:05 AM): XD
renayorama (12:15:20 AM): Yeah
zanydoodles (12:15:25 AM): whoops
renayorama (12:15:30 AM): Heh, it's okay
renayorama (12:15:35 AM): *REALLY DOESN'T MIND*
renayorama (12:16:24 AM): They're not that bad.
renayorama (12:16:46 AM): I also haven't been reading a lot because of FFXII. >>
zanydoodles (12:16:51 AM): they're not bad in and of themselves. like most things, they have their proper uses
zanydoodles (12:17:02 AM): it's when they get purple-tinged that they get out of hand
zanydoodles (12:17:38 AM): overused, over-elaborate, things like that.  few things that are "againast the Rules of Writing (???)" are actually bad in and of themselves.
zanydoodles (12:18:36 AM): it's most often cases of people misusing delicate devices, I think.
renayorama (12:18:44 AM): Mostly.
zanydoodles (12:18:50 AM): yes, mostly XD
renayorama (12:19:11 AM): It's the FFXII section that's going to be the most fun
renayorama (12:19:15 AM): I don't know ANY of them
zanydoodles (12:19:24 AM): I *like* to believe that any plot can be done well, any story can be carried off, given the right handling. being able to break any rule to good advantage is a corollary of that
renayorama (12:19:35 AM): FREE REIGN
zanydoodles (12:19:38 AM): XD
zanydoodles (12:20:06 AM): speaking of free reign, I have now read all the reviews and desire a similar no-punches-pulled approach if you ever do me
renayorama (12:20:20 AM): Oh! You've said it.
renayorama (12:20:23 AM): I'll do it.
zanydoodles (12:20:41 AM): believe me, false praise is far more damaging in the long run than honest negative criticism -_-
renayorama (12:20:46 AM): Oh god
renayorama (12:20:56 AM): You probably haven't see my LJ where Della and I went into it
renayorama (12:21:03 AM): You should read that when you come back
zanydoodles (12:21:10 AM): ...oh?
zanydoodles (12:21:12 AM): where?
zanydoodles (12:21:15 AM): Della?
renayorama (12:21:21 AM): delladella
renayorama (12:21:28 AM): She does editing for some sort of agency
renayorama (12:21:31 AM): Like, for a JOB
zanydoodles (12:21:41 AM): also, I should go, uh, soon. but befor then, lookit! I haven't cross-tested it in anythng but my versions of IE and Firefox, but hey! progress! http://sherkhan.dreamhost.com/paean/draft/
zanydoodles (12:21:48 AM): ooooh! professional editing!
renayorama (12:21:51 AM): http://bottle-of-shine.livejournal.com/167361.html?thread=1563585#t1563585
renayorama (12:21:56 AM): There is it for when you return
zanydoodles (12:22:01 AM): I would be interested in the profession if I could pick my client >.>
renayorama (12:22:21 AM): Oooo, pretty
renayorama (12:23:18 AM): The scrolling is neat!
zanydoodles (12:23:19 AM): the usual dislike is creeping in, though -- I'm trying to finish this design before I scrap it like I do 99% of them
renayorama (12:23:39 AM): xD
renayorama (12:23:43 AM): (I do that)
zanydoodles (12:24:36 AM): quick -- do *you* like it? I'm teetering in the middle again -__-
renayorama (12:24:48 AM): No, I've ALWAYS liked it
renayorama (12:24:57 AM): You keep making new versions and I like all of them. xD
zanydoodles (12:25:12 AM): well, that's promising!
zanydoodles (12:25:13 AM): thanks =)
zanydoodles (12:25:29 AM): also, re the comment thread that I of course started reading anyway:
"Having said that? Unless somebody says,
GIVE IT TO ME HARD, BABY, I have no desire to review."

in case I haven't worded it quite that way *yet*: GIVE IT TO ME HARD, BABY
zanydoodles (12:25:54 AM): I should find this lady and tell HER that, though. do I write in any of her fandoms?
zanydoodles (12:26:36 AM): lord, I need to stop reading this thread. I'm itching to reply.
renayorama (12:26:57 AM): XD
renayorama (12:27:00 AM): Della?
renayorama (12:27:02 AM): FFVII.
zanydoodles (12:27:15 AM): darn. definitely not into that (yet?)
renayorama (12:27:23 AM): Although she'll read anything
renayorama (12:27:26 AM): I think?
zanydoodles (12:27:28 AM): ... ooooh
renayorama (12:27:42 AM): She proofed KJ's Paine/Nooj ship manifesto
zanydoodles (12:27:48 AM): now I am intruiged. I'm also curious about her just... just because I like editing and want to be better at it.
zanydoodles (12:28:47 AM): I'm also.... uh... I just realized I think I'm going through one of those periods where I hate HARD everything I've published to this point. oddly, this is not affecting my current writing at all -- I feel no animosity towards that
zanydoodles (12:29:02 AM): maybe it's because I feel I've learned a lot since I last finished a story. I dot think that's true.
renayorama (12:29:19 AM): I go through that
renayorama (12:29:22 AM): Every. Day.
renayorama (12:30:11 AM): Della is hilarious and very talented.
zanydoodles (12:30:26 AM): I must meet her and worship her duly.
renayorama (12:30:28 AM): KIND OF LIKE YOU
zanydoodles (12:30:32 AM): what.
renayorama (12:30:35 AM): WHEN YOU ARE INVOVLED IN FANDOM
zanydoodles (12:30:39 AM): WHAT
renayorama (12:30:41 AM): *WAVES THE COME BACK SOON SIGN*
zanydoodles (12:30:50 AM): stop that, my flee reflex is kicking in XD
renayorama (12:30:55 AM): NO
renayorama (12:30:57 AM): *REFUSES*
zanydoodles (12:31:01 AM): "if people in fandom (like me) are thinking about trying for a writing career, PERHAPS they need to be the ones hit hardest with the editing stick early on."
renayorama (12:31:07 AM): *lathers you with praise*
zanydoodles (12:31:08 AM): hear, hear!
renayorama (12:31:09 AM): Wait.
renayorama (12:31:11 AM): Lathers?
zanydoodles (12:31:14 AM): um.
zanydoodles (12:31:17 AM): KINKY?
renayorama (12:31:19 AM): ....that might have been the wrong
renayorama (12:31:20 AM): Word
zanydoodles (12:31:30 AM): ... does praise foam?
renayorama (12:31:38 AM): I think so
zanydoodles (12:31:39 AM): only foaming things lather.
renayorama (12:31:44 AM): THE SINCERE KIND
zanydoodles (12:31:47 AM): XD
zanydoodles (12:31:51 AM): AH-HA!
zanydoodles (12:31:58 AM): a test for false praise!
zanydoodles (12:32:02 AM): it doesn't FOAM.
renayorama (12:32:04 AM): Exactly. xD
renayorama (12:32:27 AM): Hee hee
renayorama (12:32:35 AM): Matt's response to my LOUD LAUGHTER:
renayorama (12:32:38 AM): "Whoa."
renayorama (12:32:47 AM): He dropped his hot pocket because I snorted
zanydoodles (12:32:58 AM): oh god your poor roommates XD
renayorama (12:33:04 AM): SEE HOW I HAVE MISSED YOU. NO ENDLESS LAUGHTER IN WEEKS.
zanydoodles (12:33:25 AM): wow. I don't get you people. you tell me I'm funny and I never ever believe you. LIES.
zanydoodles (12:33:27 AM): okay, well, uh. MOVING ON. I do want to meet Della, she sounds fascinating
zanydoodles (12:33:36 AM): I must be sure to stalk her in the morning
renayorama (12:33:39 AM): Yes!
renayorama (12:33:42 AM): FOR NOW, BED!
zanydoodles (12:33:42 AM): by replying to that thread. copiously.
zanydoodles (12:33:46 AM): tomorrow, ye
zanydoodles (12:33:47 AM): s
zanydoodles (12:33:49 AM): BED.
zanydoodles (12:34:05 AM): sleep well!
renayorama (12:34:11 AM): You, too! :-D
zanydoodles (12:34:36 AM): tell Zach he has my sympathies re FFXII. or he has Travis', at least, whether Travis himself is aware of this or not =P
zanydoodles (12:34:39 AM): g'night!
renayorama (12:35:05 AM): :-D Night!
renayorama signed off at 8:58:33 AM.
renayorama signed off at 9:12:32 AM.
renayorama signed on at 5:01:24 PM.
zanydoodles (9:16:00 PM): Nay, you failed pretty spectacularly at replying to my email =P
renayorama (9:16:07 PM): ...I'm reply right now.

Auto Response from zanydoodles (9:16:07 PM): SLEEP
renayorama (9:16:24 PM): It's because I had to go to the store for my neighbors.
zanydoodles (9:16:28 PM): I just got home and will still need to take care of a couple things
renayorama (9:16:30 PM): NEW NEIGHBORS.
renayorama (9:16:32 PM): Anyway
zanydoodles (9:16:34 PM): you doing okay?
renayorama (9:16:37 PM): Yup!
renayorama (9:16:44 PM): Word vomiting at you as we speak.
renayorama (9:16:57 PM): Since I find this letter particularly clever, you're GOING TO GET IT.
zanydoodles (9:17:20 PM): ah, excellent! I was hoping to discuss maybe some FF9 plot stuff. um. soon. maybe tonight, if I'm not braindead? amenable?
zanydoodles (9:17:42 PM): and YAY word vomit. I'll need to vanish for another hour or two, though, on business, before I can read D=
renayorama (9:17:54 PM): Okay! No biggie!
renayorama (9:17:58 PM): I'm not done writing. xD
renayorama (9:18:05 PM): It'll be there whne you get back!
zanydoodles (9:18:11 PM): excellent
zanydoodles (9:18:15 PM): bye for nowm then!
renayorama (9:19:33 PM): Bye! :-D
renayorama (9:49:42 PM): So your business was sleep? Not that I blame you. xD
renayorama (9:50:03 PM): E-mail was sent, the first thing you are required to do upon your return is READ IT.
zanydoodles (10:18:19 PM): wow, that was special XD
renayorama (10:18:24 PM): XD
renayorama (10:18:28 PM): Well.
zanydoodles (10:18:33 PM): and no, sleep was not my mission. I've had the same message up for at least a day and a half or something
renayorama (10:18:37 PM): XD
renayorama (10:18:43 PM): *NOW FEELS REALLY AWKWARD*
zanydoodles (10:18:54 PM): XD
zanydoodles (10:19:01 PM): to answer the question about aping!
zanydoodles (10:19:23 PM): what I mean is, IE is stealing tricks, not code (that I know of) from Firefox. But then,a s I recall, Mozilla is open-source, so, uh >.>
renayorama (10:19:29 PM): So my banana hypothesis was wrong.
renayorama (10:19:39 PM): OR MAYBE NOT
zanydoodles (10:20:02 PM): anyway! I saw the hovering thing of AWESOME. and hguess what. IE7 ahs it. and tabs. I applaud them for pulling their heads of of their asses, but they get mazny negative points for shoving them right back in because they have done NOTHING new.
zanydoodles (10:20:05 PM): NOTHING.
zanydoodles (10:20:18 PM): just took what Firefox had and implemented it with likely much buggier code.
renayorama (10:20:58 PM): Oh, that's lame.
zanydoodles (10:21:21 PM): observe: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:IE7_Quick_Tabs.png
renayorama (10:22:11 PM): BANANA STEALERS
renayorama (10:22:27 PM): I happen to know because the hover this is FROM APPLE.
zanydoodles (10:22:40 PM): which, by the way, is a trick possibly taken from the OSX operating sytem. OSX has a feature called Expose' (pretend that's an accented e at the end) that does that very thing for all open windows. but the implementations of Firefox and OSX are definitely different
renayorama (10:22:43 PM): Zach's iMac does it!
renayorama (10:22:53 PM): THAT'S WHY I WANTED IT
zanydoodles (10:23:00 PM): oh yeah, Expose rocks.
renayorama (10:23:08 PM): I'm burning all my Gates/Jobs slash
renayorama (10:23:09 PM): BURNING
renayorama (10:23:12 PM): *sets fire to*
zanydoodles (10:23:21 PM): WHOAH WHOA WHOA LET ME READ THAT
renayorama (10:23:23 PM): XD
zanydoodles (10:23:25 PM): HATESEX?????
renayorama (10:23:29 PM): Well, I would if I had it. xD
renayorama (10:23:33 PM): Hee hee
renayorama (10:23:42 PM): UH, IF IT WAS ANY KIND OF SEX.
renayorama (10:23:45 PM): It would be hate sex
renayorama (10:23:52 PM): Gates is totally the bitch.
renayorama (10:23:54 PM): Just saying
zanydoodles (10:24:10 PM): no, no. I'm with you there.
zanydoodles (10:24:16 PM): Jobs went to my school for a semester =D
renayorama (10:24:20 PM): Ooo
zanydoodles (10:24:37 PM): anyway, my main problems with IE7 are mostly continuing not following standards, stealing ideas from superior software and not adapting them IN ANY WAY, and being REQUIRED.
zanydoodles (10:24:49 PM): you know you couldn't get rid of IE on a Windows machine even if you tried, right?
zanydoodles (10:25:04 PM): It's built into Windows. Literally. The Explorer (as in, for your files) is IE in disguise.
renayorama (10:25:30 PM): ...
renayorama (10:25:33 PM): That's so lame.
zanydoodles (10:25:39 PM): yep.
renayorama (10:25:43 PM): WELL
renayorama (10:25:48 PM): re: BEDSORES.
zanydoodles (10:26:55 PM): I have a confession.
renayorama (10:27:00 PM): ...
renayorama (10:27:12 PM): Oh no.
zanydoodles (10:27:16 PM): Sometimes I visit Wikipedia just to look up Microsoft-manufactured products and read nothing bu the "Criticisms" section.
zanydoodles (10:27:23 PM): it brings me not-so-secret GLEE.
renayorama (10:28:15 PM): XD!
zanydoodles (10:29:02 PM): hey, let's keep Gates-bashing. Windows Vista basically doesn't allow third-party security.
zanydoodles (10:29:44 PM): so, basically, if you don't trust Microsoft with your computer's security and want to get another, third-party program to help out... you can't.
renayorama (10:30:30 PM): Uh
renayorama (10:30:38 PM): What
zanydoodles (10:30:45 PM): oh, you can install them, I guess, but they locked the kernel up.
zanydoodles (10:30:50 PM): no third-party access, apparently.
zanydoodles (10:31:18 PM): basically, third-party security programs can't get inside the OS, and so can't activate critical security features.
renayorama (10:31:57 PM): So that seems like it would make Windows Vista WAY UNPOPULAR
zanydoodles (10:32:43 PM): har har. I think some European group(s?) are suing Microsoft for violating anti-monopoly laws over that or something. I don't know, I heard this a while ago.
zanydoodles (10:33:05 PM): not allowing free competition in the desktop security market or some such. I see their point.
renayorama (10:33:35 PM): Yeah
renayorama (10:33:38 PM): I have to say uh
renayorama (10:33:49 PM): I'm thinking of a Mac when I switch computers. >.>
renayorama (10:33:53 PM): <.<
renayorama (10:34:14 PM): I feel like a traitor
zanydoodles (10:34:31 PM): traitor? to WHAT? XD
renayorama (10:34:59 PM): Oh, the OST and I don't have problems.
renayorama (10:35:08 PM): Wait, wrong...letters
renayorama (10:35:11 PM): Anyway
renayorama (10:35:22 PM): I've never had PROBLEMS besides with IE.
renayorama (10:35:35 PM): Everything else: TOTALLY FINE.
renayorama (10:35:42 PM): I am a rare breed?
renayorama (10:35:46 PM): Apparently.
zanydoodles (10:36:03 PM): not too much. casual use of Windows usually doesn't produce too many problems.
zanydoodles (10:36:16 PM): I just happen to be a developer and use my computers very heavily
zanydoodles (10:36:36 PM): although this particular computer is used for browsing, word-processing, and chatting, and Windows STILL dies hardcore on it.
zanydoodles (10:37:28 PM): and it's not even running XP -- wouldn't be able to handle that thing, too bloated. good old 2000 on here, and still slow as hell.
renayorama (10:37:42 PM): Yikes
zanydoodles (10:37:47 PM): that's one of the biggest problems with Windows in general -- HORRIFIC memory management
zanydoodles (10:38:00 PM): need to be restarted frequently to dump the RAM cache and such
zanydoodles (10:38:14 PM): OSX is built on UNIX, and those babies can stay on for YEARS at a time.
renayorama (10:38:45 PM): See!
renayorama (10:38:47 PM): I waaaant that
renayorama (10:39:01 PM): Sarah had Clint Eastwood, and he was so tiny and neat
renayorama (10:39:04 PM): WANT
zanydoodles (10:39:17 PM): Clint Eastwood? >.>
renayorama (10:39:21 PM): Her laptop
zanydoodles (10:39:28 PM): ah. Mine is called Luscious XD
renayorama (10:39:40 PM): My laptop is called "poor thing"
zanydoodles (10:39:41 PM): for the record. Travis' is Cthulu.
renayorama (10:39:55 PM): Like, on the network: POOR THING
zanydoodles (10:39:58 PM): XDDDD
renayorama (10:40:04 PM): NOT NAMED BY ME
renayorama (10:40:07 PM): Just saying
zanydoodles (10:40:43 PM): Mine earned its name after having the full contents of a glass of water spilled on it while it was turened on, and surviving.
zanydoodles (10:40:57 PM): My dormies (who used it a lot) figured it deserved a name after that.
zanydoodles (10:41:19 PM): I don't remember if I named it. I think Andrei did, actually. But anyway, I digress.
zanydoodles (10:41:49 PM): okay, so. one more bit of Microsoft stupidity, and I swear I'll stop (for the night)
zanydoodles (10:42:03 PM): okay, so. The Zune, you know it, yeah?
zanydoodles (10:43:09 PM): among idiotic things like not being able to play songs bought by Microsoft customers from two earlier attempts at a music store, I find this bit particularly fascinating
zanydoodles (10:43:22 PM): unlike the iPod, the Zune has built-in Wi-Fi.
renayorama (10:43:37 PM): ....wi-fi?
renayorama (10:43:39 PM): How come?
zanydoodles (10:43:41 PM): this should be AWESOME, right? if iPod had that, it would be ALL KINDS OF GREAT, right?
renayorama (10:43:49 PM): Yeah.
zanydoodles (10:44:06 PM): you could interface with your computer wirelessly, connect to other iPods wirelessly, download music wirelessly...
zanydoodles (10:44:11 PM): but iPod doesn't have it
zanydoodles (10:44:13 PM): Zune does
zanydoodles (10:44:18 PM): and what do they do with it?
zanydoodles (10:44:20 PM): SQUAT.
renayorama (10:44:22 PM): Nothing?
zanydoodles (10:45:23 PM): you can connect to other Zune players and transfer SOME songs (which then die after 3 days or 3 plays -- 1 minute or halway in, whechever comes first, counting as a "play" -- even if the song was an independent track you owned outirght or just some damn sound you recotrded yourself).
zanydoodles (10:45:28 PM): that's IT.
zanydoodles (10:45:36 PM): no wireless computer connection.
zanydoodles (10:45:41 PM): no wireless downloads.
zanydoodles (10:46:16 PM): I don't think you can even view the library of a connected Zune, from what I hear in reviews.
zanydoodles (10:46:26 PM): just send and recieve songs that will then die.
renayorama (10:46:38 PM): ....what's the point of them DYING?
zanydoodles (10:46:46 PM): copyright, theoretically.
zanydoodles (10:46:53 PM): you have to buy the songs yourself for them to survive.
renayorama (10:47:11 PM): Well, then that seems functional
renayorama (10:47:15 PM): Why not do THAT?
zanydoodles (10:47:16 PM): this MIGHT have been reasonable if they checked for copyright flags, but they don't.
zanydoodles (10:47:44 PM): meaning, if you recorded your nephew's first words or something and tried to send those, they'd expire.
zanydoodles (10:48:12 PM): also, while the Zune's screen IS slightly bigger than the iPod's, they actually display the same number of pixels. har, har.
zanydoodles (10:48:44 PM): also, I am confused by what you said -- "why not do THAT?" what's "that"?
renayorama (10:49:27 PM): Well, trading songs via devices
renayorama (10:49:47 PM): If they had wi-fi, couldn't they tap into the online system after so many plays and say, "purchase?"
zanydoodles (10:49:53 PM): you can, but not all songs, and they die.
renayorama (10:49:55 PM): Like, wouldn't that make more SENSE.
renayorama (10:50:08 PM): Dear Microsoft,
renayorama (10:50:09 PM): WHAT
renayorama (10:50:14 PM): Confusion, Nay
renayorama (10:50:35 PM): I mean, same principle when moving around song bought via iTunes
zanydoodles (10:50:47 PM): it WOULD be nice (and legal) if you did what the Zune does now but then has the option of also, right there, right then, WIRELESSLY, buying the song.
renayorama (10:51:02 PM): Yeah
zanydoodles (10:51:14 PM): anyway
zanydoodles (10:51:24 PM): Microsoft and its spawn make me froth at the mouth, as you can see.
renayorama (10:51:32 PM): Just a little
renayorama (10:51:37 PM): Well, they make me capslock
zanydoodles (10:51:41 PM): time for another topic!
zanydoodles (10:51:56 PM): you pick, I'm just tired of my useless rage =P
renayorama (10:52:02 PM): LIKE DISAGREEING WITH RECCERS.
renayorama (10:52:06 PM): Okay, no, that's more rage
renayorama (10:52:08 PM): Um
zanydoodles (10:52:23 PM): WHOA WHOA WHOA
zanydoodles (10:52:25 PM): sound interesting
renayorama (10:52:30 PM): Hahaha
renayorama (10:52:45 PM): It's not, just me going, "MY FAVORITE RECCER HAS GONE RETARDED!"
zanydoodles (10:52:46 PM): TOTALLY ON TOPIC AND TACTFUL: what did you say in response to Regann?
zanydoodles (10:52:56 PM): who is this favourite reccer?
renayorama (10:52:58 PM): I said: Regann, WHAT
renayorama (10:53:07 PM): Confusion, Nay
renayorama (10:53:11 PM): Pretty much
renayorama (10:53:27 PM): She said that she traced one of the anonymous comments to Kim
renayorama (10:53:31 PM): Which I'm not buying
zanydoodles (10:53:50 PM): good call. I'd be fascinated to actually read it, but seeing as it's private correspondence, can't actually demand to see it or anything XD
zanydoodles (10:53:57 PM): who, whaaat?
zanydoodles (10:53:59 PM): Kim?
renayorama (10:54:05 PM): Kim comments on her journal all the time, so if it WAS Kim she'd have all the amunition in the world to go after her
renayorama (10:54:23 PM): I'm sorry, an IP tracing to the same "block" doesn't mean anything
zanydoodles (10:54:46 PM): the same "block"? WHAT. also, just one comment?
renayorama (10:54:58 PM): There was another, from Oregon
zanydoodles (10:55:02 PM): uh
zanydoodles (10:55:10 PM): well, that could be suspected to be ME
zanydoodles (10:55:12 PM): but SORRY
zanydoodles (10:55:15 PM): I LIVE IN VIRGINIA
renayorama (10:55:19 PM): XD
renayorama (10:55:28 PM): I dont know, I guess
renayorama (10:55:36 PM): I guess after everything I find it all a bit stupid
renayorama (10:55:57 PM): And I told her as much, that my backing off was just in interest of not making things awkward for our mutual friends.
zanydoodles (10:55:57 PM): if this is a plot on her part, it's appalingly retarded. if it isn't, it is highly confusing. what.
renayorama (10:56:16 PM): The timing of the anonymous comments of doom is just lame.
zanydoodles (10:56:41 PM): I mean. geez, I WANT to give her credit for more brains than this. I want to believe that if she were behind it she'd not be so... lame...
renayorama (10:56:59 PM): I don't know, the comment thing seems not her style, anyway.
zanydoodles (10:57:00 PM): so basically I'm balking at that idea because I want ot think she's smarter than that.
renayorama (10:57:10 PM): I don't think she even LISTENS to Destiny's Child
zanydoodles (10:57:20 PM): yeah, her style seems to involve more... well. BRAIN.
zanydoodles (10:57:27 PM): Regann's not stupd, I swear.
renayorama (10:57:27 PM): Yeah
zanydoodles (10:57:29 PM): also
zanydoodles (10:57:33 PM): DESTINY'S CHILD.
zanydoodles (10:57:34 PM): WHAT.
renayorama (10:57:47 PM): Yeah, theyleft Destiny's Child lyrics
renayorama (10:57:58 PM): *boggle*
zanydoodles (10:58:03 PM): ... can I see some of these harassment type comments?
renayorama (10:58:07 PM): Really sort of offensive, so no wonder she thought it was me
zanydoodles (10:58:32 PM): wiait, you're offensive?
zanydoodles (10:58:33 PM): uh
renayorama (10:58:39 PM): http://regann.livejournal.com/226918.html?mode=reply
zanydoodles (10:58:53 PM): when I see offensive Destiny's Child lyrics, I swear, my brain doesn't automatically go HAY THAR NAY
renayorama (10:58:57 PM): XD
renayorama (10:59:01 PM): Just in context
renayorama (10:59:19 PM): I had the thought (and then dismissed it, because I'm only talked to four people about this)
renayorama (10:59:32 PM): That it might have been someone that wanted to me and her BOTH
zanydoodles (10:59:45 PM): whoa
zanydoodles (10:59:49 PM): it's like a bad novel plot
zanydoodles (10:59:57 PM): exfand "fandom domain" into "kingom"
zanydoodles (11:00:16 PM): and "BNF status" to "countess" or "Parliament"
zanydoodles (11:00:20 PM): and you have awful fantasy.
renayorama (11:00:47 PM): >.>
renayorama (11:01:01 PM): I'm not a BNF. ;_______;
renayorama (11:01:08 PM): Although I apparently have a new minion
renayorama (11:01:26 PM): Who messages me and says every five minutes, "I'm not bothering you, am I!"
renayorama (11:01:32 PM): "I don't want to annoy you!"
renayorama (11:01:39 PM): "I respect you a lot!"
renayorama (11:01:45 PM): CREEPED OUT
zanydoodles (11:02:04 PM): at this point I am well tired of whatever is going on in Regann's head. she seems stressed. I also am not sure I like ehr tone in a lot of her entries. But I used to respect her intelligence a lot, so for now I'm writing this whole episode off as a lot of stress/nerves on her part and hoping it will blow over soon. FOR EVERYBODY.
zanydoodles (11:02:16 PM): wait, what? minion? who? someone fromthe Seifer/Zell chat?
renayorama (11:02:22 PM): No
zanydoodles (11:02:33 PM): (EVERYBODY = YOU)
renayorama (11:02:34 PM): colichemarde from ff_100
zanydoodles (11:02:50 PM): oh! her! I think it's a her. them. I remember them!
renayorama (11:02:56 PM): I think it's a guy
zanydoodles (11:02:59 PM): god, I hope I wasn't that annoying when I first talked to you XD
renayorama (11:02:59 PM): I think.
renayorama (11:03:02 PM): No.
renayorama (11:03:17 PM): It was pretty hilarious when he was all on the "I RESPECT YOU LINE!"
zanydoodles (11:03:30 PM): well, I had the advantage of having not a clue as to your fandom status. I was just like "Hey, interesting person. Conclusion: WORD VOMIT"
renayorama (11:03:41 PM): Right at that moment a friend signed on and went, "RENEE I HATE YOU FOREVER AND HOPE YOU DIE OF HERPES!"
zanydoodles (11:03:50 PM): wow.
renayorama (11:03:54 PM): Then signed off
renayorama (11:04:07 PM): Apparently she crunched the eggs I put under her drivers side seat
zanydoodles (11:04:09 PM): I am glad I don't have many people who IM me >.>
renayorama (11:04:12 PM): Four months ago.
zanydoodles (11:04:16 PM): ... ouch
renayorama (11:04:23 PM): On purpose.
zanydoodles (11:04:28 PM): XD
renayorama (11:04:33 PM): I was a calculated act of revenge
zanydoodles (11:04:45 PM): XD
renayorama (11:04:49 PM): She got honey all over my ass from her nasty car. I STUCK TO A CHAIR IN A PUBLIC PLACE.
renayorama (11:04:55 PM): Now she'll HAVE to clean
zanydoodles (11:05:01 PM): eww
zanydoodles (11:05:08 PM): yeah, I vote that a good move on your part.
zanydoodles (11:05:17 PM): I can't abide dirty cars.
zanydoodles (11:05:20 PM): MESSY is fine.
renayorama (11:05:20 PM): Nope.
zanydoodles (11:05:26 PM): but dirty, like with food and smel;ls everywhere
zanydoodles (11:05:28 PM): uh
zanydoodles (11:05:29 PM): NO
renayorama (11:05:30 PM): PLEASE CLEAN IT OUT
renayorama (11:05:34 PM): It is not a pantry
renayorama (11:05:36 PM): Or a fridge
renayorama (11:05:40 PM): Thanks
zanydoodles (11:06:17 PM): yeah. I don't care if there's like papers and books and CD and stuff scattered around (the normal state of my car; could you tel?? XD) but no perishables, please.
renayorama (11:06:21 PM): XD
renayorama (11:06:25 PM): re: reccing
zanydoodles (11:06:29 PM): ooh, right!
renayorama (11:06:32 PM): Becky has no taste. WHAT HAS HAPPENED.
zanydoodles (11:06:43 PM): I thought it might be her!
zanydoodles (11:06:45 PM): I don't know!
zanydoodles (11:06:50 PM): she used to be so reliable!
renayorama (11:06:53 PM): Woe.
renayorama (11:07:10 PM): Like, she fawned all over this story that I am um. Going to review.
zanydoodles (11:07:11 PM): I think she has either been in fandom too long or is now more interested in quantitiy than quality.
renayorama (11:07:12 PM): And uh
renayorama (11:07:21 PM): OH WELL
zanydoodles (11:07:39 PM): ALAS, ALACK
renayorama (11:07:43 PM): COME BACK SOON, IRA.
zanydoodles (11:08:02 PM): what, to rec for you? XD
renayorama (11:08:06 PM): Yes!
renayorama (11:08:08 PM): Oh
renayorama (11:08:13 PM): Speaking of
renayorama (11:08:19 PM): Amy sort of pounced on me
renayorama (11:08:22 PM): Like, OUT OF NOWHERE
zanydoodles (11:08:29 PM): okay?
renayorama (11:08:30 PM): And I opened the avatar_flashfic community
renayorama (11:08:45 PM): It's rather like ff_100, just two weeks, instead of one.
renayorama (11:09:05 PM): I assumed you would be okay with this since it's what you mentioned previously!
zanydoodles (11:09:09 PM): ooh, excellent!
renayorama (11:09:15 PM): TOMORROW: NEW EPISODE.
renayorama (11:09:18 PM): UH.
renayorama (11:09:21 PM): VERY BIG DEAL
zanydoodles (11:09:22 PM): yeah, sure. I'll help out with modding when I come back.
zanydoodles (11:09:28 PM): I missed the last one D=
renayorama (11:09:31 PM): ME TOO
renayorama (11:09:38 PM): ...in fact, I think I'm two behind
renayorama (11:09:41 PM): Oops
renayorama (11:10:05 PM): I opened my rec site!
zanydoodles (11:10:11 PM): oh well. I'll try and catch it. no friends in town, yay
renayorama (11:10:11 PM): I'm writing Seifer/Irvine!
zanydoodles (11:10:17 PM): WHOA
renayorama (11:10:19 PM): That's all the news I have
renayorama (11:10:25 PM): I thik
renayorama (11:10:32 PM): Pretty sure.
zanydoodles (11:10:38 PM): hm!
zanydoodles (11:10:41 PM): mostly exciting!
zanydoodles (11:10:44 PM): some of it stupid!
zanydoodles (11:10:50 PM): (Regann mess, Becky. WHAT.)
renayorama (11:11:00 PM): (I KNOW, BUT I JUST ROLL WITH IT)
renayorama (11:11:12 PM): I'm a pretty good reccer, I think
renayorama (11:11:14 PM): Well
renayorama (11:11:18 PM): OH
renayorama (11:11:26 PM): Or.
renayorama (11:11:30 PM): Maybe I gave that to you already
renayorama (11:11:33 PM): Or was it KJ
zanydoodles (11:11:37 PM): uh
renayorama (11:11:37 PM): I FORGET
zanydoodles (11:11:38 PM): ?
renayorama (11:12:11 PM): http://www.livejournal.com/tools/memories.bml?user=isiscolo&keyword=website+statistics&filter=all
renayorama (11:12:22 PM): For when you return!
zanydoodles (11:13:36 PM): ehoa, definitely news!
zanydoodles (11:13:37 PM): ...
zanydoodles (11:13:44 PM): I need to start keeping a FANDOM DOSSIER.
zanydoodles (11:13:48 PM): with a PLANNER.
zanydoodles (11:14:00 PM): where I can write down all the links you want me to visit and the stuff you want me to read
zanydoodles (11:14:05 PM): so I can CHECK THINGS OFF.
renayorama (11:14:12 PM): ....um
renayorama (11:14:15 PM): Sorry?
zanydoodles (11:14:22 PM): no, I'm amused XD
renayorama (11:14:34 PM): For the record, perhaps this is a good idea!
renayorama (11:14:42 PM): XD
zanydoodles (11:15:16 PM): oh god, at this point, it surely is
zanydoodles (11:15:26 PM): hmm, hmm, hmm
zanydoodles (11:15:32 PM): does Zach work with ASP.NET at all?
renayorama (11:15:37 PM): Uh
renayorama (11:15:40 PM): No.
zanydoodles (11:15:44 PM): or the 'NET platform at all
renayorama (11:15:46 PM): Because he sleeps a lot
zanydoodles (11:15:50 PM): C#, maybe?
renayorama (11:15:50 PM): *flail*
zanydoodles (11:15:57 PM): is he awake?
renayorama (11:16:00 PM): He's at work
renayorama (11:16:07 PM): I could ask him in an hour and a half!
zanydoodles (11:16:15 PM): ah!
zanydoodles (11:16:29 PM): well, sure, if you don't mind.
zanydoodles (11:16:41 PM): I'm thinking of writing a program to compete with it, is all.
zanydoodles (11:16:51 PM): My little FUCK YOU to Microsoft.
zanydoodles (11:17:01 PM): working only with FREE languages, thank you.
zanydoodles (11:17:21 PM): ASP is a server-side scripting language, like PHP, but it's closed-source and you have to pay for it.
zanydoodles (11:17:23 PM): har, har.
renayorama (11:18:04 PM): Ooo
renayorama (11:18:14 PM): That's kind of
renayorama (11:18:15 PM): Hmm
renayorama (11:18:20 PM): CODE SHOULD BE FREE
renayorama (11:18:27 PM): FREE LOVE.
renayorama (11:18:32 PM): *hippy*
zanydoodles (11:18:35 PM): basically, the primary function of the .NET platform is making various languages/interfaces work together. ASP, C#, C++, SQL
zanydoodles (11:19:01 PM): but for one, many of the languages involved are proprietary, and the software itself (a) COST A GODDAMN FORTUNE and (b) IS BLOATED AS ALL HELL.
zanydoodles (11:19:19 PM): it's part of the reason too few people use the free languages like PHP and the mySQL database
zanydoodles (11:19:33 PM): there's no program that makes interfacing between databases, server-side, and client-side work easy
zanydoodles (11:20:01 PM): that's basically 'NET's job, but it works with technologies I dislike (because they cost monye to use) and it soits out HORRENDOUS client-side code.
zanydoodles (11:20:07 PM): THAT DOESN'T VALIDATE.
renayorama (11:20:30 PM): *weeps*
renayorama (11:20:42 PM): I think this is a rage topic for you. ;-)
zanydoodles (11:20:42 PM): if it weren't for the .NET-generated code in the applications, all my designs for my job here would validate.
zanydoodles (11:20:57 PM): well, okay, let me clear something up
zanydoodles (11:21:09 PM): people doing their jobs poorly is a rage topic for me.
zanydoodles (11:21:24 PM): this, and most other things I rant about, basically fall udner that
renayorama (11:21:25 PM): Well, maybe we should go see how ERIC'S designs look in INTERNET EXPLORER SEVEN
renayorama (11:21:31 PM): I bet that would be cheerful
zanydoodles (11:21:38 PM): shoddy writing, shoddy coding, shoddy modding, etc.
renayorama (11:21:44 PM): We could sneak in
renayorama (11:21:49 PM): Convert ninja-like
zanydoodles (11:21:54 PM): not that I'm not guilty of all of the above ( I SHORE AM, MA'AM) but still, rage.
renayorama (11:22:05 PM): Are you guilty of shoddy ANYTHING
renayorama (11:22:09 PM): I DISAGREE.
renayorama (11:22:17 PM): *lathers praises on you*
renayorama (11:22:20 PM): LOOK. FOAM.
zanydoodles (11:22:24 PM): remind me to wipe his designs of data belonging to the government and show them to you. god.
zanydoodles (11:22:28 PM): XDDD
zanydoodles (11:22:31 PM): FOAM
zanydoodles (11:22:56 PM): thankfully, he is joining the army in two weeks.
renayorama (11:22:59 PM): Uh
renayorama (11:23:00 PM): WOW
renayorama (11:23:02 PM): That's random!
zanydoodles (11:23:04 PM): I hope he doesn't get sent to Iraq.
zanydoodles (11:23:10 PM): he's an idiot, but he's not a bad person.
renayorama (11:23:11 PM): "THEY'RE STIFLING MY CREATIVITY!"
zanydoodles (11:23:12 PM): just an idiot.
renayorama (11:23:17 PM): Then: *ENLISTS*
zanydoodles (11:23:24 PM): yeah, I have no idea.
renayorama (11:23:26 PM): I hate to say it
zanydoodles (11:23:30 PM): his first choice was firefighter, apparently.
renayorama (11:23:33 PM): His creativity is dead.
zanydoodles (11:23:53 PM): well, he's going to a good place, then.
zanydoodles (11:23:57 PM): creativity is not encouraged.
zanydoodles (11:24:02 PM): oh hay
zanydoodles (11:24:07 PM): more on the work front
zanydoodles (11:24:17 PM): I was called in for my first application evaluation today!
renayorama (11:24:21 PM): Your boss DOES spend a lot of time at the spa?
renayorama (11:24:22 PM): oH
renayorama (11:24:28 PM): that's even better!
renayorama (11:24:31 PM): I think!
zanydoodles (11:24:44 PM): my position on the Usability Group actually also includes evaluating applications to make sure they're not reatrded
zanydoodles (11:24:46 PM): THANK GOD.
zanydoodles (11:24:50 PM): you know what this means?
zanydoodles (11:24:54 PM): I *AM* QUALITY CONTROL.
zanydoodles (11:24:56 PM): POWER.
zanydoodles (11:24:58 PM): *drunk*
renayorama (11:25:00 PM): ULTIMATE COSMIC POWER
zanydoodles (11:25:05 PM): XD
zanydoodles (11:25:07 PM): as for my boss
zanydoodles (11:25:20 PM): no, he doesn't spend much time at the spa. he spends much time in my family's sauna.
zanydoodles (11:25:23 PM): he's a friend of the family.
renayorama (11:25:28 PM): Well
renayorama (11:25:30 PM): I was close.
zanydoodles (11:25:43 PM): comes by just about every weekend. I see him half-naked and sweating about once a week.
renayorama (11:25:43 PM): Spa, sauna! I WAS OFF THREE LETTERS.
zanydoodles (11:26:34 PM): he's a great boss, actually. he doesn't micromanage his team, he only lets competent people work with him, and he's one of those managers who worked his way up from developer ranks by merit, not someone with a fancy degree in "communications" or whatever
zanydoodles (11:26:45 PM): he rocks, really, and is awesome to me and helps me not be retarded at office politics
zanydoodles (11:26:56 PM): he also dumps work on me, because he trusts me to goddamn DO it.
renayorama (11:27:09 PM): Hee
renayorama (11:27:15 PM): Well, hey! A GOOD BOSS.
zanydoodles (11:27:19 PM): it's a little heavier flow than usual today because we have a MAJOR DEADLINE next Tuesday, though.
renayorama (11:27:25 PM): Lame deadlines.
renayorama (11:27:29 PM): GLAD WHEN THAT'S OVER.
zanydoodles (11:27:33 PM): YES PLEASE
zanydoodles (11:27:37 PM): I WANT MY LFIE BACK.
renayorama (11:27:52 PM): So you can ignore me for Travis instead of work! *SOB*
zanydoodles (11:27:59 PM): XD
zanydoodles (11:28:07 PM): it's okay, we're good at living independently of each other.
zanydoodles (11:28:29 PM): me and Travis, that is
zanydoodles (11:29:02 PM): anyway, I went to my first evaluation today. it is so WEIRD to see all these people TWICE MY AGE actually listening to me like I'm their equal. Their superior, actually, since I get to tell them what to do.
zanydoodles (11:29:04 PM): POWERETRIP.
zanydoodles (11:29:08 PM): well, not really.
zanydoodles (11:29:15 PM): mostly I try not to melt on the spot out of sheer nerves.
renayorama (11:29:19 PM): So it went okay?
zanydoodles (11:29:34 PM): well. I did okay, I think. Nancy, part of my team, says so.,
zanydoodles (11:29:41 PM): but the application I was evaluatin..
zanydoodles (11:29:42 PM): uh...
zanydoodles (11:29:46 PM): well, it was not a disaster!
zanydoodles (11:30:06 PM): about twice as good re aesthetics and usability as anything relse I've seen in my branch
zanydoodles (11:30:44 PM): however, their hover drop-down menus relied entirely on javascript, as did two other KEY FUNCTIONAL THINGS.
zanydoodles (11:30:47 PM): NOT ACCESSIBLE.
zanydoodles (11:30:54 PM): also, table-based layout.
zanydoodles (11:31:44 PM): the basic diagnosis was to make some urgent minor-to-medium fixes and release this version, then come consult my team for a complete overhaul of the next version.
zanydoodles (11:31:57 PM): I simply cannot comprehend how webmasters function without stylesheets.
renayorama (11:32:07 PM): *blink*
renayorama (11:32:11 PM): I uh
renayorama (11:32:16 PM): Well, I'm not REALLY one
renayorama (11:32:26 PM): I did okay for awhile. xD
zanydoodles (11:32:31 PM): so did I
zanydoodles (11:32:37 PM): but it's, uh
zanydoodles (11:32:45 PM): what that awful saying?
zanydoodles (11:32:52 PM): "Once you you black you never go back"
zanydoodles (11:32:55 PM): or something
zanydoodles (11:33:08 PM): *you go
zanydoodles (11:33:31 PM): anyway, I failed at being offensive there. HAR. BY THE WAY, CAN YOU TELL I AM STARVED FOR ONLINE LIFE???
renayorama (11:33:48 PM): XD!
renayorama (11:34:00 PM): I choked on my banana there
renayorama (11:34:03 PM): HEE HEE
renayorama (11:34:12 PM): FUNNY STORY RE: CSS
zanydoodles (11:34:17 PM): yes!
zanydoodles (11:34:18 PM): go!
zanydoodles (11:34:19 PM): shoot!
renayorama (11:34:21 PM): I learned how to like, have a gradient background!
renayorama (11:34:22 PM): YES!
renayorama (11:34:27 PM): *crickets*
zanydoodles (11:34:29 PM): oooh!
zanydoodles (11:34:35 PM): show me!
renayorama (11:34:39 PM): I uh
renayorama (11:34:40 PM): Um
renayorama (11:34:46 PM): *quivers*
renayorama (11:34:54 PM): I CANNOT.
renayorama (11:35:02 PM): WE'D HAVE TO GET E-DIVORCED
zanydoodles (11:35:05 PM): aww!
zanydoodles (11:35:07 PM): why? XD
renayorama (11:35:12 PM): I used tables as uh
renayorama (11:35:26 PM): Well, as divs
renayorama (11:35:34 PM): HO HO HO
renayorama (11:35:47 PM): Basically I was lazy and drug up a layout I made...
renayorama (11:35:52 PM): in June 2005
zanydoodles (11:36:02 PM): well, that's okay for practice
renayorama (11:36:03 PM): It's like a cobbled together version of CRAP
renayorama (11:36:09 PM): and NEW STUFF THAT'S COOL
zanydoodles (11:36:21 PM): I want to see the gradient part!
renayorama (11:36:44 PM): VIEW SOURCE AND THE UNIVERSE WILL DEFINITELY EXPLODE
renayorama (11:36:51 PM): http://www.echthroi.org/godhand/
renayorama (11:37:15 PM): Anyway, I need to remember how to float things!
renayorama (11:37:23 PM): And then out regular divs in
renayorama (11:37:33 PM): BUT IT'S UP! And I'm okay with it for now.
renayorama (11:37:45 PM): PS: I steal code from everywhere
zanydoodles (11:37:58 PM): CONFESSION!
renayorama (11:38:00 PM): So if it's WRONG, well, ho ho ho! CAN'T BLAME ME.
renayorama (11:38:13 PM): You hate gradients?
zanydoodles (11:38:39 PM): I think "stealing" code -- i.e. looking at someone's source and yoinking bits of it -- is okaya s long as you take the time to deconstruct it and understand it an adapt it.
zanydoodles (11:38:44 PM): then it's a greta learning tool
zanydoodles (11:38:48 PM): subsections that are NOT okay
zanydoodles (11:38:57 PM): taking neat/very creative tricks without credit.
zanydoodles (11:38:58 PM): not cool.
renayorama (11:39:05 PM): Well, the problem is
renayorama (11:39:14 PM): I can't make it work like that.
renayorama (11:39:18 PM): NEAT TRICKS?
renayorama (11:39:23 PM): Yeah, not so much with the working
renayorama (11:39:34 PM): I have to start from the bottom up.
renayorama (11:39:51 PM): I think I found how to do the back uh
renayorama (11:39:57 PM): On the wordpress support forums
renayorama (11:40:03 PM): Yup
zanydoodles (11:40:05 PM): are you familair with A List Apart? I forget.
renayorama (11:40:07 PM): *pets it*
zanydoodles (11:40:09 PM): I may have asked before.
renayorama (11:40:13 PM): Yeah, you showed me
renayorama (11:40:24 PM): I never remember these things until AFTER I spent an hour scouring google
renayorama (11:40:37 PM): I live a hard life.
zanydoodles (11:40:38 PM): that's a good place for both neat tricks and basic understanding
zanydoodles (11:41:44 PM): anyway, yeah. I approve of learning from others as long as innovationa nd crativity is given proper credit and you take the time to UNDERSTAND.
renayorama (11:41:49 PM): I uh
renayorama (11:41:57 PM): Understand how to apply a gradient background now?
renayorama (11:42:04 PM): *BIG SMILES!*
zanydoodles (11:42:13 PM): that's good!
renayorama (11:42:20 PM): *mourns her tables*
zanydoodles (11:42:32 PM): this is our key right here, yes? background: #BBD1E5 url('http://www.echthroi.org/godhand/images/bg.png') repeat-x top;}
renayorama (11:42:41 PM): Okay, well
renayorama (11:42:53 PM): I'll admit to not really getting te REPEAT part.
zanydoodles (11:43:07 PM): ah! that's the key part
renayorama (11:43:10 PM): I fiddled with it to see what happened when I messed it up, though. xD
zanydoodles (11:43:15 PM): would you like me to explain?
renayorama (11:43:15 PM): X words!
renayorama (11:43:17 PM): Y, not so much
renayorama (11:43:23 PM): Sure!
zanydoodles (11:43:43 PM): okay. you know how graphs work, right, with an x and y axis?
renayorama (11:43:51 PM): Maaath
renayorama (11:43:53 PM): But yes
zanydoodles (11:43:57 PM): usually x goes across and y goes up, right?
renayorama (11:44:18 PM): Yes!
zanydoodles (11:44:24 PM): if you're talking positive numbers, then the intersection of zeroes, the origin, is in the lower right corner.
zanydoodles (11:44:41 PM): by convention, on computer monitors, x does go positive to the right, but y goes positive DOWN.
zanydoodles (11:44:54 PM): so the origin is in the upper left of the screen
zanydoodles (11:45:23 PM): which, incidentally, is why most positioning systems specifcy a "top" and "left" parameter
zanydoodles (11:45:53 PM): "top" means the distance from the top -- how many pixels DOWN the y-axis the top edge of whatever-it-is
zanydoodles (11:46:15 PM): and "left" for how many pixels along the x-axis the left edge is
zanydoodles (11:46:25 PM): for backgrounds, you can specify position like that, too
zanydoodles (11:46:35 PM): as well as which direction they tile in
zanydoodles (11:46:46 PM): you know about tiling backgrounds, yes?
renayorama (11:47:04 PM): I'm pretty sure I remember that most of them are preeetty ugly
zanydoodles (11:47:10 PM): take an image (hopefully without seams at the borders) and repeat it infinitely across the screen
zanydoodles (11:47:19 PM): well, the tiling happens in two directions, down and across
renayorama (11:47:32 PM): Ah, then yes!
zanydoodles (11:47:37 PM): on the monitor system of coordinates, this means they tile down the y-axis and across the x-axis
zanydoodles (11:47:57 PM): so, if you want to repeat the image HORIZONTALLY, you want to tile it across the x-axis. "repeat-x"
renayorama (11:48:13 PM): And now things make sense!
zanydoodles (11:48:14 PM): to tile it VERTICALLY, you repeat it across the y-axis. repeat-y
zanydoodles (11:48:32 PM): you can also not repeat it at all: no-repeat
zanydoodles (11:48:52 PM): or repeat it in both directions, which is what you probably think of when you think tiled background: repeat
zanydoodles (11:48:58 PM): so, that's that.
zanydoodles (11:49:35 PM): for future reference, very helpful: http://www.w3schools.com/css/css_reference.asp
zanydoodles (11:50:18 PM): this is also a good place: lots mroe explnatation, but less of an all-in-one reference list: http://academ.hvcc.edu/~kantopet/old/index.php
renayorama (11:50:37 PM): You're like.
zanydoodles (11:50:41 PM): specifically, for CSS: http://academ.hvcc.edu/~kantopet/old/css/index.php
renayorama (11:50:44 PM): A WELL OF INFORMATION
zanydoodles (11:50:50 PM): this is my job! XD
renayorama (11:50:54 PM): XD
renayorama (11:51:04 PM): I just make amateur webpages. xD
zanydoodles (11:51:22 PM): which is loads of fun =D
zanydoodles (11:51:37 PM): okay, well. fun for me, at least. cause I'm a dork.
renayorama (11:51:58 PM): Well, I like it, until it gets mathy
zanydoodles (11:52:19 PM): yeah, that can suck
renayorama (11:52:31 PM): *NO MATH BRAIN!*
zanydoodles (11:52:45 PM): oh, arithmetic!
zanydoodles (11:53:03 PM): bane of my existence XD
renayorama (11:53:30 PM): That thing I linked you to
renayorama (11:53:36 PM): Gave me BAD IDEAS for the archive.
renayorama (11:53:38 PM): Bad ones
zanydoodles (11:53:44 PM): I figured it would!
renayorama (11:53:47 PM): re: referal tracking
zanydoodles (11:53:48 PM): I haven't read it all, mind
renayorama (11:53:57 PM): YOU'LL SEE WHAT I MEAN when you read the commets
zanydoodles (11:54:09 PM): I saw it was HUGE and fled XD
renayorama (11:54:13 PM): XD
zanydoodles (11:54:17 PM): I'll read it when I come back!
renayorama (11:54:20 PM): There's loads of posts
renayorama (11:54:23 PM): It took KJ a while
renayorama (11:54:27 PM): It took ME a while
renayorama (11:54:28 PM): MATH
renayorama (11:55:33 PM): Well, when you come back you can also beta for me!
renayorama (11:55:40 PM): I BET YOU'RE LOOKING FORWARD TO THAT
renayorama (11:55:51 PM): *horrifies you so you never return*
zanydoodles (11:56:14 PM): actually, I AM looking forward to it
zanydoodles (11:56:22 PM): I've actually been wanting to edit... SOMETHING
zanydoodles (11:56:30 PM): I like editing, remember?
renayorama (11:56:34 PM): http://bottle-of-shine.livejournal.com/167361.html?thread=1572289#t1572289 *cough*
zanydoodles (11:56:34 PM): what have you got for me this time?
renayorama (11:56:54 PM): Oh, I'm writing a bangonfic post about recommending and feedback
renayorama (11:57:01 PM): I need to NOT look like a jerk!
renayorama (11:57:43 PM): It's not a story but uh. It's thoughtful?
zanydoodles (11:58:18 PM): oh, is this my public-relations function again?
renayorama (11:58:27 PM): Hahaha, I guess. xD
zanydoodles (11:58:40 PM): I swear sometime you will realize that employing a social retard to be your PR person is a BAD IDEA
renayorama (11:59:22 PM): Never. :-D
zanydoodles (12:00:04 AM): well, I'll surely take a look, but I hope you have some fic for me to look at soon!
renayorama (12:00:29 AM): If you play FFVIII eventually I'll have lots? xD
zanydoodles (12:01:06 AM): I will! and then I'll read your published stuff. but I do like editing!
zanydoodles (12:01:14 AM): more than I like reviewing, really
renayorama (12:01:32 AM): That's!
renayorama (12:01:45 AM): Pretty special!
zanydoodles (12:01:51 AM): ?
zanydoodles (12:01:52 AM): >.>
renayorama (12:02:36 AM): There's not a lot of people that LIKE editing
renayorama (12:02:42 AM): Like. Me.
renayorama (12:02:47 AM): But it's not my strength.
renayorama (12:03:00 AM): My strength is uh
renayorama (12:03:02 AM): ...
zanydoodles (12:03:16 AM): doing the actual writing, silly.
renayorama (12:03:15 AM): Well, something! I'm sure!
renayorama (12:03:25 AM): Your strength: EVERYTHING.
renayorama (12:03:27 AM): And EVERYTHING ELSE.
zanydoodles (12:03:52 AM): uh
zanydoodles (12:03:58 AM): I have a flee-reflex, remember?
zanydoodles (12:04:08 AM): you know you've triggered it when I start "uh" and "um" ing
renayorama (12:04:08 AM): You do. xD
renayorama (12:04:22 AM): You shouldn't flee!
zanydoodles (12:04:55 AM): it's a very ingrained response, trust me
renayorama (12:05:05 AM): I'll never learn. xD
zanydoodles (12:05:39 AM): neither will I
renayorama (12:06:16 AM): IT'S OKAY. I have your address!
renayorama (12:06:25 AM): CAN'T HIDE FOR LONG
renayorama (12:07:04 AM): Your entire family:  WHY IS THERE IS CLOUD SAYING "IRA IS AWESOME!" IN THE SKY OVER OUR HOME?
renayorama (12:07:23 AM): You: *FLEES*
renayorama (12:08:16 AM): Just like now. XD
zanydoodles (12:08:18 AM): that would be a quite a feat.
renayorama (12:09:10 AM): >.>
renayorama (12:09:12 AM): <.<
renayorama (12:09:15 AM): *shuts up*
zanydoodles (12:11:37 AM): sorry, just distracted!
zanydoodles (12:13:00 AM): maaan
zanydoodles (12:13:13 AM): I waned to talk story plot (or lack?? thereof D=) with you
zanydoodles (12:13:22 AM): but it's midnight. SLEEP OR FANDOM.
renayorama (12:14:28 AM): HMM
renayorama (12:14:29 AM): GEE
renayorama (12:14:41 AM): WELL, WE KNOW THE HEALTHY CHOICE.
zanydoodles (12:15:23 AM): aw, man XD
renayorama (12:16:10 AM): XD
renayorama (12:16:17 AM): Dear work, PLZ STFU
renayorama (12:16:26 AM): *sulks in corner*
zanydoodles (12:16:32 AM): aww!
zanydoodles (12:16:35 AM): well, uh
zanydoodles (12:16:42 AM): I will try to make up for it by making this story awesome?
zanydoodles (12:16:47 AM): it needs love ;_;
zanydoodles (12:17:11 AM): I like the idea so much but I am suddenly aparanoid that it's not DOING enough
renayorama (12:17:22 AM): Nooo! It will be great
zanydoodles (12:17:25 AM): therefore, I've been rearranging my outline covertly during meetings all week >.>
renayorama (12:17:35 AM): I will send my army of minions to review!
zanydoodles (12:18:00 AM): XD
zanydoodles (12:18:10 AM): well, I am less worried about reviews and more about making the thing work
renayorama (12:18:22 AM): Uh!
zanydoodles (12:18:23 AM): uh
renayorama (12:18:39 AM): I think I need to play so I can be MARGINALLY HELPFUL!
zanydoodles (12:18:45 AM): XD
zanydoodles (12:18:46 AM): do!
zanydoodles (12:18:55 AM): you finished FFXII, right?
renayorama (12:19:53 AM): No, still final battle to go
renayorama (12:20:00 AM): But like, it won't even be HARD.
renayorama (12:20:03 AM): I'm so overleveled
zanydoodles (12:20:25 AM): confession! I'm in the same situation with FFIX
zanydoodles (12:20:42 AM): unfortunately my PS started refusing to load the world map recently. WHAT.
renayorama (12:21:03 AM): D:
zanydoodles (12:21:24 AM): yeah, I need to fix that. stupid PS -_-
zanydoodles (12:21:34 AM): I'll go ask my local video game store about it tomorrow
zanydoodles (12:21:40 AM): I know the guy there by now; he's nice.
renayorama (12:21:46 AM): WHY ARE WE HAVING SO MUCH BAD LUCK!
renayorama (12:21:47 AM): Woez
zanydoodles (12:23:25 AM): bad luck or no, I love these two: http://bluelaguna.net/viewimage/ff9/fmvshots/1443/46.jpg
renayorama (12:23:31 AM): I'M TOTALLY ALLOWED TO SPAM YOU WITH FANART?
renayorama (12:23:32 AM): Y/N
renayorama (12:23:36 AM): I CHOOSE Y
renayorama (12:23:39 AM): http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/43897624
renayorama (12:23:58 AM): <3!!!
renayorama (12:24:25 AM): I may go ahead and beat XII just so I can start IX, and then go back to XII to complete sidequests
renayorama (12:24:33 AM): There's a boss battle in FFXII I want to beat
renayorama (12:24:40 AM): Where the baddie has 50 million HP
zanydoodles (12:24:50 AM): what.
renayorama (12:24:54 AM): Yeah.
zanydoodles (12:25:00 AM): what.
renayorama (12:25:05 AM): Yeah.
zanydoodles (12:25:17 AM): ... bring lots of potions >.>
zanydoodles (12:25:21 AM): fanart!
renayorama (12:25:22 AM): Hahaha
zanydoodles (12:25:23 AM): PURR
renayorama (12:25:27 AM): I KNOW
renayorama (12:25:29 AM): >.>
renayorama (12:25:39 AM): I want to see this pairing written well. >>
zanydoodles (12:25:45 AM): ME TOO.
renayorama (12:25:51 AM): Dear fandom: PLEASE? ;___;
zanydoodles (12:26:47 AM): Dear fandom: SECONDED
zanydoodles (12:26:53 AM): OH HAY
zanydoodles (12:26:56 AM): LION KING FANART
zanydoodles (12:27:06 AM): WHY DO I LOVE THIS PICTURE?? http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/35082947/
zanydoodles (12:27:23 AM): I'm so... TICKLED by it
renayorama (12:27:45 AM): UM
renayorama (12:27:46 AM): CHARMED
renayorama (12:27:51 AM): ...oddly enough
zanydoodles (12:28:55 AM): I KNOW
zanydoodles (12:28:57 AM): isn't it weird??
zanydoodles (12:29:06 AM): http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/9205669/
renayorama (12:29:36 AM): That's so cuuuuute
zanydoodles (12:29:47 AM): APPARENTLY I LIKE EVIL FAMILIES
zanydoodles (12:29:59 AM): have you seen this? I don't remember: http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/42619788/
renayorama (12:33:00 AM): NO
renayorama (12:33:01 AM): OMG
zanydoodles (12:33:08 AM): I don't even remember where I found it. you may have shown it to me for all I know XD
zanydoodles (12:33:29 AM): ... maybe not, then!
zanydoodles (12:33:32 AM): anyway, Jet art
zanydoodles (12:33:48 AM): this is because NOT ENOUGH ART FOR THIS FANDOM: http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/5204190/
zanydoodles (12:34:15 AM): and may I introduce the BEST DISNEY CRACK GAY FURRY PAIRING EVER???? http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/4324903/
zanydoodles (12:34:40 AM): to avveliate the trauma of the above, a nice, kosher Donald: http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/19852161/
renayorama (12:37:38 AM): *WIDE EYES*
zanydoodles (12:38:03 AM): yeessss?
renayorama (12:38:05 AM): Okay
renayorama (12:38:13 AM): Now I need Mushu/Timon fic
renayorama (12:38:17 AM): *STARES AT YOU*
zanydoodles (12:38:28 AM): BEST DISNEY CRACK GAY FURRY PAIRING *EVER*, RIGHT???
renayorama (12:38:38 AM): I AGREE.
zanydoodles (12:38:55 AM): whoever came up with it is a GENUIS, I say
zanydoodles (12:39:04 AM): GOLDEN dialogue and interaction.
zanydoodles (12:39:05 AM): GOLDEN.
renayorama (12:39:10 AM): XD
zanydoodles (12:39:11 AM): also, they are the same damn size XD
zanydoodles (12:39:29 AM): anyway, uh
zanydoodles (12:39:40 AM): in an effort to evade that SIGNIFICANT LOOK you just gave me
renayorama (12:39:41 AM): XD
zanydoodles (12:39:45 AM): http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/30745711/
renayorama (12:39:49 AM): *STARES MORE*
zanydoodles (12:39:50 AM): Katara waterbending is HOT.
zanydoodles (12:39:52 AM): HOT.
renayorama (12:40:10 AM): I AGREE.
zanydoodles (12:40:22 AM): hair colouring a little awkward but considering the sketchiness of the original line art and the HOT, can be forgiven
zanydoodles (12:40:32 AM): sketch is also 1000% awesome http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/30745711/
zanydoodles (12:40:40 AM): err http://www.deviantart.com/view/30698464/
zanydoodles (12:40:44 AM): yeah, that one
renayorama (12:40:50 AM): Zach doesn't use ASP.NET
zanydoodles (12:40:58 AM): good for him.
renayorama (12:41:07 AM): He doesn't know what C# is
zanydoodles (12:41:17 AM): tell him to keep on not using it
zanydoodles (12:41:17 AM): EBUL.
zanydoodles (12:41:42 AM): C# is a programming language from the same family as C++ and Java
zanydoodles (12:41:48 AM): uh
zanydoodles (12:41:49 AM): kind of
zanydoodles (12:41:53 AM): I'm still learning it.
renayorama (12:42:28 AM): is it object-oriented only?
zanydoodles (12:43:07 AM): you can work it without doing OOP just like you can C++, is that's what he's asking?
renayorama (12:43:21 AM): Yeah
zanydoodles (12:43:23 AM): but like I said, still learning. I'm not pretending to have any idea what I'm talking about here
renayorama (12:43:39 AM): I'm sure you and he will have LOTS OF BRAINY CONVOS SOON
zanydoodles (12:44:07 AM): probably, lord when we get into more archive stuff
zanydoodles (12:44:08 AM): ...
zanydoodles (12:44:17 AM): I'm staring at the Timon/Mushu picture >.>
renayorama (12:44:19 AM): ...
renayorama (12:44:22 AM): And?
zanydoodles (12:44:25 AM): uh
renayorama (12:44:28 AM): GETTING FIC IDEAS?
zanydoodles (12:44:35 AM): staring. at how Mushu is biting Timon's ear.
zanydoodles (12:44:49 AM): I FEEL DIRTY XD
renayorama (12:44:52 AM): HAHAHA
zanydoodles (12:44:53 AM): OH GOD MY CHILDHOOD
renayorama (12:44:53 AM): I DON'T
renayorama (12:44:57 AM): *LOVES IT*
zanydoodles (12:45:01 AM): Oh, I ADORE
zanydoodles (12:45:02 AM): it
zanydoodles (12:45:05 AM): I'm reccing it.
renayorama (12:45:07 AM): I should write some cracked out crossover
zanydoodles (12:45:14 AM): yes please.
renayorama (12:45:20 AM): But first I'd need to watch the movies again
zanydoodles (12:45:21 AM): or, rather
zanydoodles (12:45:23 AM): YES PLZ
zanydoodles (12:45:47 AM): I think that's one of the best ideas I've ever heard.
zanydoodles (12:46:10 AM): how about you put that somewhere on your to-do list
zanydoodles (12:46:13 AM): HIGH UP.
zanydoodles (12:46:21 AM): WHERE I CAN MAKE GRABBY HANDS AT IT
renayorama (12:46:26 AM): XD
zanydoodles (12:46:53 AM): oh god. I crack up at the very thought.
zanydoodles (12:47:29 AM): the best part is that this could possibly be slipped into KH fic. MAYBE.
zanydoodles (12:48:20 AM): wow, it's uh
zanydoodles (12:48:21 AM): 1am
renayorama (12:48:29 AM): YES
renayorama (12:48:38 AM): You didn't choose the healthy route. xD
zanydoodles (12:48:53 AM): maybe >.>
renayorama (12:49:10 AM): Getting kind of itchy being all ADULT
zanydoodles (12:49:19 AM): ?
renayorama (12:51:30 AM): You!
renayorama (12:51:33 AM): FANDOM
renayorama (12:51:35 AM): IT CALLS YOU
renayorama (12:51:43 AM): WHO NEEDS TO SLEEP
zanydoodles (12:51:45 AM): IT DOES
renayorama (12:51:47 AM): XD
zanydoodles (12:51:54 AM): I do, until my pesentation!
zanydoodles (12:52:04 AM): work for which will be done tomorrow, theoretically
zanydoodles (12:52:06 AM): so
zanydoodles (12:52:09 AM): FANDOM WEEKEND
zanydoodles (12:52:10 AM): I HOPE
renayorama (12:52:42 AM): EXCELLENTNEWS
zanydoodles (12:54:27 AM): until then, though, I should catch some sleep!
renayorama (12:55:08 AM): Okay! Have a nice rest!
zanydoodles (12:55:52 AM): g'night!
renayorama (12:56:15 AM): Night! :-D
renayorama signed off at 9:16:46 AM.
renayorama signed on at 5:12:50 PM.
zanydoodles (8:11:22 PM): watching avatar upstairs, can't talk, but I'm home
renayorama (8:47:13 PM): IF THEY DO THAT
renayorama (8:47:17 PM): IF THEY DO IT
renayorama (8:47:20 PM): I QUIT AVATAR
renayorama (8:47:34 PM): HEALING SCAR = NO.
renayorama (8:49:45 PM): NO NO NO NO NO NO
renayorama (8:52:50 PM): Oh. Zuko failed me. :-(
renayorama (8:59:32 PM): Okay
renayorama (8:59:46 PM): When you come back, please tell me what happened after Katara left
zanydoodles (9:00:52 PM): OH MY GOD I WILL KILL ZUKO
renayorama (9:00:58 PM): I HATE HIM
zanydoodles (9:01:01 PM): I HOPE HE HAS A MORAL CRISIS NEXT SEASON.
renayorama (9:01:03 PM): I HATE HIM
renayorama (9:01:51 PM): He better pull a RABBIT out of his hat to make me love him again
zanydoodles (9:01:54 PM): I don't hate him. I actually like him more as a character. but as a, um. person. I think I want to kick him in the balls.
renayorama (9:02:44 PM): Is it--um
renayorama (9:02:50 PM): Could he be lying? ;_;
renayorama (9:02:59 PM): Like, "keep your enemies closer?"
renayorama (9:03:04 PM): *weeps*
zanydoodles (9:03:18 PM): I' beginning to develop a tragic theory about Azula
zanydoodles (9:03:33 PM): not tragic because something bad happens to her in the series, but about her execution
zanydoodles (9:03:39 PM): I finally understand what she's supposed to be.
zanydoodles (9:03:52 PM): she's a typical dictator. psychopathic, terrifying, and utterly charming.
zanydoodles (9:04:02 PM): or she's SUPPOSED to be, but the execution is a little botched/awkward.
renayorama (9:04:48 PM): >.>
renayorama (9:04:53 PM): I don't find her charming at all
zanydoodles (9:06:20 PM): oh, no, not like that.
zanydoodles (9:06:24 PM): she doesn't charm ME.
zanydoodles (9:06:29 PM): she charms and sways others.
zanydoodles (9:06:36 PM): charm as in, she has charisma
zanydoodles (9:06:38 PM): CHARISMATIC
zanydoodles (9:06:40 PM): there we go.
renayorama (9:06:45 PM): Ah ha!
renayorama (9:06:46 PM): So.
renayorama (9:06:51 PM): Months of wondering
zanydoodles (9:06:59 PM): about Azula?
zanydoodles (9:07:33 PM): I'm putting my thoughts about Azula in a comment on this episode's post
renayorama (9:08:26 PM): No.
renayorama (9:08:27 PM): Zuko.
renayorama (9:08:30 PM): How did he!
renayorama (9:08:35 PM): Like, with Katara
zanydoodles (9:08:44 PM): uh
zanydoodles (9:08:47 PM): you lost me.
zanydoodles (9:08:48 PM): utterly.
renayorama (9:08:50 PM): SORRY
renayorama (9:09:07 PM): He was all *APOLGETIC!* and *WE HAVE SOMETHING IN COMMON!*
renayorama (9:09:14 PM): Then, ruined it!
renayorama (9:09:19 PM): RUINED EVERYTHING
zanydoodles (9:09:23 PM): blame it on Azula.
renayorama (9:09:25 PM): At least Iroh didn't die. :-(
zanydoodles (9:09:29 PM): she's a manipulator.
zanydoodles (9:09:38 PM): it's Zuko's own damn fault for being a moron, of course
renayorama (9:09:43 PM): I will continue to believe he is fooling her!
renayorama (9:09:49 PM): UNTIL IT IS PROVEN OTHERWISE.
zanydoodles (9:09:54 PM): Iroh is my new hero
zanydoodles (9:09:56 PM): well, okay.
zanydoodles (9:09:57 PM): not new.
zanydoodles (9:10:02 PM): CONTINUING HERO.
renayorama (9:10:13 PM): Yeah
renayorama (9:10:15 PM): I love him
renayorama (9:10:25 PM): Can you tell me what happened after Katara left?
renayorama (9:10:37 PM): Matt called and was like, "FIND THIS RANDOM PIECE OF PAPER FOR ME NOW!"
renayorama (9:10:42 PM): GOD
zanydoodles (9:11:17 PM): oh, um. when katara left with Aang?
zanydoodles (9:11:20 PM): after the big fight?
renayorama (9:11:22 PM): Yeah
renayorama (9:11:26 PM): I missed everything
zanydoodles (9:11:43 PM): there was only like 30 seconds after that.
zanydoodles (9:11:54 PM): as soon as Iroh saw they were safe, he surrendered.
zanydoodles (9:12:10 PM): He looked stoic and very much like his jaw might be set in supressed anger.
zanydoodles (9:12:38 PM): then there were two scenes with Aang and co and with Azula and Zuko, etc.
zanydoodles (9:12:47 PM): don't remember the order, though. I think Aang was last
zanydoodles (9:13:00 PM): anyway, Azula and Zuko were in the throne room and she was telling him he'd come back to the Fire Nation a hero
zanydoodles (9:13:15 PM): he said he still didn't have the avatar and what if his father didn't restore his honour
zanydoodles (9:13:45 PM): Azula, sounding very sinister (IN MY OPINION -- I SWEAR SHE WAS ABOUT TO VOTE TO KILL OF DAD OR SOMETHING) said Zuko had earned back his honour himself that day
zanydoodles (9:14:10 PM): with itnernmittent propaganda-type outbursts from Azula about great day in history, hundred years of resistance, etc
renayorama (9:14:09 PM): >.>
zanydoodles (9:14:17 PM): Zuko turned away and looked miserable.
zanydoodles (9:14:21 PM): or doubtful
zanydoodles (9:14:22 PM): or something
renayorama (9:14:23 PM): :-(
zanydoodles (9:14:24 PM): GOOD.
renayorama (9:14:27 PM): Zuko, whhhhhy
renayorama (9:14:42 PM): Well, from his perspective, there's no winning. :-(
renayorama (9:14:43 PM): Maybe?
zanydoodles (9:14:52 PM): and then Aang and everyone (including the Earth King and possibly his goddamn bear) were flying away into the night on Appa
zanydoodles (9:15:22 PM): Katara was cradling Aang, and she took out her magic spring water and tried to heal the huge wound on Aang's back
zanydoodles (9:15:43 PM): it looked like it wasn't working and she started crying but then Aang came to and they hugged and looked absolutely miserable.
zanydoodles (9:15:48 PM): after the tired smiles, of course.
zanydoodles (9:15:52 PM): still miserable, though
zanydoodles (9:16:00 PM): and the Earth King says that the Earth Kingdom has fallen.
renayorama (9:16:01 PM): :-(
renayorama (9:16:12 PM): I mean, I wasn't exactly expecting a HAPPY ENDING
renayorama (9:16:13 PM): But um
zanydoodles (9:16:31 PM): I'm writing mroe extensive thoughts on the episode in a comment -- cna you respond to it when I finish?
renayorama (9:16:35 PM): Yeah
zanydoodles (9:16:36 PM): I'm getting tired of repeating myself XD
renayorama (9:16:43 PM): I just wanted to know what happened omg
renayorama (9:16:47 PM): *SO MAD!*
renayorama (9:16:55 PM): Stupid piece of paper
zanydoodles (9:17:44 PM): it's okay, it'll circulate on the internet soon
zanydoodles (9:17:49 PM): but I guarantee, NOT HAPPY.
renayorama (9:19:07 PM): And I caused so much review wank
renayorama (9:19:08 PM): fuck
renayorama (9:19:10 PM): this day
renayorama (9:19:11 PM): sucks
zanydoodles (9:19:17 PM): what??
zanydoodles (9:19:22 PM): oh no, what happened??
renayorama (9:20:47 PM): *weeps*
renayorama (9:20:51 PM): I am so distraught
renayorama (9:21:03 PM): Kim's mad, KJ's hurt, Ikon's gone into seclusion
zanydoodles (9:21:11 PM): what happened??
renayorama (9:22:13 PM): I reviewed some of KJ's work, and Ikon had left a...rude comment, I guess.
renayorama (9:22:20 PM): Kim took issue with it after I pointed it out
renayorama (9:22:26 PM): Kim and Ikon disagreed.
renayorama (9:22:34 PM): KJ and Ikon disagreed.
renayorama (9:22:47 PM): Ikon posted on her journal, upset, and Kim ad she disagreed MORE there
renayorama (9:24:02 PM): *cries*
renayorama (9:24:13 PM): And then Avatar RIPPED OUT MY HEART
zanydoodles (9:25:25 PM): ... can I see what happened? and it looks like this was just a chain of events that you started but had no control over
zanydoodles (9:25:33 PM): I mean, you couldn't have predicted this, from what it sounds like!
renayorama (9:26:53 PM): If I had been awake, maybe I could've talked Kim out of taking issue
renayorama (9:27:06 PM): review of Landing: http://community.livejournal.com/10000_needles/2768.html
renayorama (9:27:22 PM): the story: http://owlmoose.livejournal.com/204912.html
renayorama (9:27:45 PM): And the rest is pretty easy, since all you have to do is follow the link to Ikon's journal.
zanydoodles (9:30:01 PM): give me a second to sort through, okay?
zanydoodles (9:30:11 PM): meanwhle, I repeat, I don't think you did anything that awful!
renayorama (9:30:20 PM): >.>
zanydoodles (9:30:25 PM): unfortunate things followed, but I don't think they're really your fault>
zanydoodles (9:30:26 PM): ?
zanydoodles (9:30:56 PM): I mean, the review was not mean or anything
zanydoodles (9:31:00 PM): and then you went to sleep, right?
renayorama (9:31:03 PM): Yeah.
zanydoodles (9:31:07 PM): YOU ARE NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR THE ACTIONS OF OTHERS.
zanydoodles (9:31:19 PM): THEY are.
zanydoodles (9:34:52 PM): hey.
zanydoodles (9:35:27 PM): I can't see, were you involved past the intial review and pointing Ikon's comment out?
renayorama (9:36:47 PM): No?
zanydoodles (9:37:10 PM): then how is this your fault? it's unfortunate, but I hope you aren't beating yourself up or anything?
renayorama (9:37:29 PM): Like, I would have rather there been, like.
renayorama (9:37:34 PM): FEEDBACK
renayorama (9:37:40 PM): Than wank. ;_;
zanydoodles (9:38:30 PM): ?
renayorama (9:38:53 PM): Like, I would rather people follow and give feedback
renayorama (9:38:57 PM): Than start wank.
zanydoodles (9:39:15 PM): ah
renayorama (9:39:15 PM): Kim could've left feedback, but she didn't do it.
renayorama (9:39:21 PM): She just started an argument with KJ.
renayorama (9:39:24 PM): Ikon
renayorama (9:39:25 PM): NAMES
renayorama (9:39:29 PM): Oh, well
renayorama (9:39:31 PM): And KJ too
renayorama (9:39:38 PM): Because apparently she's upst now
renayorama (9:41:15 PM): *crawls into a hole*
zanydoodles (9:42:54 PM): wow, uh. I need to finish reading this >>>
zanydoodles (9:43:40 PM): um. names ;___________;
zanydoodles (9:43:51 PM): Ikon is... kunstarniki?
renayorama (9:44:08 PM): Yes.
renayorama (9:44:15 PM): KJ is owlmoose
renayorama (9:44:17 PM): You know Kim.
zanydoodles (9:44:20 PM): yeah
renayorama (9:44:24 PM): Ikon will use different letters in her subject lines
renayorama (9:44:25 PM): I
renayorama (9:44:26 PM): X
renayorama (9:44:30 PM): She's a multiple
zanydoodles (9:44:36 PM): what.
renayorama (9:44:45 PM): Personalities?
zanydoodles (9:44:51 PM): ... oh>
zanydoodles (9:44:52 PM): ?
zanydoodles (9:44:53 PM): really?
renayorama (9:45:03 PM): She says
renayorama (9:45:13 PM): Nothing to prove otherwise.
zanydoodles (9:45:40 PM): I see no X's, so I guess it's just I talking?
zanydoodles (9:45:44 PM): but, well
zanydoodles (9:46:10 PM): uh. I'm sorry everyone is so upset, but the initial thing was a pretty silly thing to get so worked up over.
renayorama (9:46:23 PM): Well, I'm coming at it from another angle
renayorama (9:46:25 PM): We all are
renayorama (9:46:29 PM): It's not the first time
zanydoodles (9:46:30 PM): yeah, I know.
renayorama (9:46:32 PM): It won't be the last
renayorama (9:46:35 PM): Ikon is rude
zanydoodles (9:46:36 PM): I speak as someone cimpletely uninvolved.
renayorama (9:46:51 PM): And she character bashes Rikku and Wakka all the time
zanydoodles (9:47:01 PM): I mean. the review was positive. she said unflattering things about the characters in a very blunt way. I took it as a (very) left-handed compliment?
renayorama (9:47:14 PM): Backwards compliments
renayorama (9:47:20 PM): She likes to hand them out
renayorama (9:47:31 PM): It upsets ME.
zanydoodles (9:47:44 PM): I mean, some people hate characters and thing they're either bad people/characters or very poorly done in canon. ideally, you get over it and mvoe on, so I think Kim overreacted there a bit >.>
renayorama (9:47:53 PM): Because when someone says something like that about the characters they're making quality judgments about the people who see depth to them.
zanydoodles (9:47:58 PM): that Ikon does this chronically (I gather) is not good, but still.
renayorama (9:48:07 PM): So because it's not the first time.
renayorama (9:48:14 PM): I don't really blame Kim for getting upset.
renayorama (9:48:22 PM): Just for dragging it out.
zanydoodles (9:48:29 PM): hmm
zanydoodles (9:48:55 PM): well, I don't take things like that personally. maybe a difference in perception, there. I see how it CAN be a personal insult, but my gut reaction is to shrug and not waste empotional energy on it.
renayorama (9:49:05 PM): Ah, well
renayorama (9:49:07 PM): Kim is.
renayorama (9:49:09 PM): >.>
renayorama (9:49:11 PM): Emotional.
zanydoodles (9:49:15 PM): so, I guess Kim's reaction was just her eprsonal way of dealing with such events, but yeah, the dragging out was wholly unnecessary
zanydoodles (9:50:41 PM): oh, people!  this is why being a hermit is a good idea.
zanydoodles (9:50:52 PM): I'm sorry that devolved so far, though
renayorama (9:51:10 PM): So instead of positive attention
renayorama (9:51:13 PM): The story gets, uh
renayorama (9:51:15 PM): NOTHING
zanydoodles (9:52:10 PM): Still, I don't think it's in any way your fault. The only misstep I see in your part was NOT the review but that you pointed out Ikon's comment, knwoing how emotional Kim is and how rude Ikon can be. Other than that, I don't think you should view this as a disaster, nor as a disaster that's the fault of your reviews
zanydoodles (9:52:27 PM): I'm pretty sure Kim would have found the comment anyway, though.
zanydoodles (9:52:39 PM): well! I can do absolutely nothing here!
zanydoodles (9:52:51 PM): except of course, read the story and leave a nice bit of positive attention =)
zanydoodles (9:57:15 PM): wow. uh. was I offensive?
renayorama (9:58:15 PM): No. :-(
renayorama (9:58:37 PM): I just thought--people don't LIKE reading about people insulting characters they like when they go to read fic about them
renayorama (9:58:53 PM): Like, "Yay, happy story about Wakka and Rikku!" Then "Oh. Character bashing."
renayorama (9:59:16 PM): I guess I was wrong, but--I tend to warn for things like that because I would want to be warned.
renayorama (9:59:35 PM): Just to be prepared if I did read it, or to opt not to browse comments
renayorama (9:59:37 PM): I dunno.
zanydoodles (10:00:57 PM): well, you can't control the actions of others, like I said. let me understand the timeline -- you think Kim looked because of what you said in your review, right?
renayorama (10:01:53 PM): Yeah.
zanydoodles (10:02:36 PM): then it was Kim's choice to look. she was warned, and I think you were right to include the warning.
zanydoodles (10:03:05 PM): it's a little akin to a review like yours warning that a fic includes rape or something and tehn someone reads the warning and goes over there to wank about the rape.
zanydoodles (10:04:33 PM): if she has that much of a problem with comments like the one Ikon made, possibly it would have been better for them to try and discuss it in private?
zanydoodles (10:04:36 PM): I don't know, it's messy.
zanydoodles (10:05:05 PM): but I take back what I said -- I thought you wanred Kim specifically, and didn't just include it in general in your review, so I think you're utterly blameless here, from what I know.
renayorama (10:05:35 PM): Oh
renayorama (10:05:42 PM): Nope. It was in the review, first sentence
zanydoodles (10:05:51 PM): yeah, I read that
zanydoodles (10:05:57 PM): and I think it was a good idea to include it.
zanydoodles (10:06:32 PM): from what I can see, Kim went in with both eyes open and overreacted a little and then things dragged on. much more trouble thank it should have been =\
zanydoodles (10:07:05 PM): I think Ikon accidentally hit a PARTICULAR sore spot, though?
zanydoodles (10:07:09 PM): about intellectualism?
zanydoodles (10:07:15 PM): and Kim couldn't have known that.
renayorama (10:07:33 PM): Well, as Raven said, Ikon's picky
renayorama (10:07:39 PM): Relating in uh
renayorama (10:07:41 PM): Fandom terms
renayorama (10:07:50 PM): She likes Nooj because he's "INTELLECTUAL!"
renayorama (10:07:57 PM): And Rikku and Wakka she doesn't because they're not.
renayorama (10:08:20 PM): Except how she's retarded--Nooj isn't INTELLECTUAL, he's SUICIDAL.
renayorama (10:08:31 PM): She just chooses to see him a certain way, and dismiss other characters
renayorama (10:08:51 PM): Which is what she does to people who she decides are not...intellectual.
zanydoodles (10:09:10 PM): yeah, I know the type.
zanydoodles (10:09:15 PM): I used to be one, I think.
renayorama (10:09:26 PM): Oh.
renayorama (10:09:27 PM): uh.
zanydoodles (10:09:52 PM): well, I certainly hope I'm not that way now!
zanydoodles (10:10:24 PM): but I was a retarded teen, I guess. I believed some pretty silly things. I don't think I ever intentionally looked down on people who weren't intellectual, but I defintiely had a predisposition to do so.
zanydoodles (10:10:55 PM): possibly caused by my upbringing, seeing as I had never known anyone other than intellectuals. I like to think I've grown out of that stupidity -_-
zanydoodles (10:11:08 PM): wow, maybe I shouldn't admit my own shortcoming so much >.>
renayorama (10:11:33 PM): We all have them
renayorama (10:11:50 PM): Mine is that I'm empathetic and elistist all at once
renayorama (10:11:57 PM): Therefore a huge hypocrite, all the time.
zanydoodles (10:11:59 PM): hey, I'm like that too XD
zanydoodles (10:12:50 PM): unfortunately, mostly the empathy stays in my head, where I constantly feel awful for other people, even if I dislike them. what comes out of my mouth is mostly the elitism because I'm trying to sound all adult =D
zanydoodles (10:12:54 PM): (I love nalyzing myself)
zanydoodles (10:13:14 PM): depressing activity, though!
zanydoodles (10:13:30 PM): anyway, I know the intellectualism thing Ikon does.
zanydoodles (10:13:58 PM): and I disagree with both her asessments of the characters (the ones O know at least) and with how she treats people
zanydoodles (10:14:05 PM): *(the ones I know)
zanydoodles (10:14:32 PM): you say this has happened before? ahev people tried to explain (CALMLY) how Ikon is being hurtful?
renayorama (10:14:53 PM): KJ has tried
renayorama (10:15:00 PM): Ikon is over 40 years old, I know that much
renayorama (10:15:39 PM): I sometimes a) question if she's lying about her age, b) if she's lying about her mental condition and c) if she's not a multiple, but just a RETARD.
renayorama (10:16:04 PM): Because she has been a discussion before, how she sums up characters she doesn't "care to explore."
zanydoodles (10:16:07 PM): well, on the internets, you never know.
renayorama (10:16:15 PM): And the same things get said
zanydoodles (10:16:16 PM): I COULD BE A 44 YEAR OLD MAN.
renayorama (10:16:19 PM): And she NEVER LEARNS
zanydoodles (10:16:36 PM): I think at the very least she has *A* mental condition.
zanydoodles (10:16:41 PM): perhaps not the one she claims.
renayorama (10:16:45 PM): Something
zanydoodles (10:17:03 PM): but I think a persistent inability to understand social courtesies like that signifies something.
zanydoodles (10:17:16 PM): Perhaps something related to Aspberger's?
zanydoodles (10:17:27 PM): something with that touch of not-wuite-getting it in the social arena.
zanydoodles (10:17:50 PM): she seemed a little bewildered as to how she was being offensive.
zanydoodles (10:18:33 PM): like I'm one to talk -- I have social problems myself. I'm very awkward, I don't catch the undercurrents of conversations very well. ah well. enough abou me =P
zanydoodles (10:18:37 PM): well, hm.
zanydoodles (10:18:46 PM): why are these people still emotionally invested in her?
zanydoodles (10:19:27 PM): is there a history, or redeeming characteristics to the relationship, or what? I mean. If someone is chronically offensive and just doesn't learn even if you try to explain, and keeps hurting you... >.>
zanydoodles (10:23:31 PM): or maybe I should shut up and stop prying
zanydoodles (10:24:07 PM): anyway, is there anything I can do? I just read the story and I'll leave a nice comment. though, uh. was this thing beta'd? I don't want to inadvertedly isult someone, sicne I wanted to amke a coupel comments to that effect...
zanydoodles (10:24:18 PM): besides that, though, is there anything I can do?
zanydoodles (10:24:41 PM): change subjects, maybe? I've got FFIX fic to talk about, if you like, or you could mosey over to the avatar comm? or.. something else?
renayorama (10:27:09 PM): Wow
renayorama (10:27:11 PM): LAG
renayorama (10:27:13 PM): WOW
renayorama (10:27:15 PM): Let me catch up
zanydoodles (10:27:19 PM): WOW
zanydoodles (10:27:27 PM): okay, yeah, uh. lots of babble >.>
renayorama (10:33:52 PM): oKAY!
renayorama (10:33:56 PM): KJ and Ikon are close.
renayorama (10:34:06 PM): They co-wrote a HUGE story together, so
renayorama (10:34:15 PM): Close. ._.
renayorama (10:34:22 PM): And no, it wasn't beta-read
zanydoodles (10:34:46 PM): huh! I went o ikon's journal and I see X now
renayorama (10:34:54 PM): Uh, yeah
zanydoodles (10:35:05 PM): X talks about Ikon in the third person. I think also talking about herslef as "we"?
renayorama (10:36:55 PM): Yeah
zanydoodles (10:37:00 PM): huh. okay.
renayorama (10:37:03 PM): It's weird
zanydoodles (10:37:16 PM): I read her... explanation.
renayorama (10:37:39 PM): Because some kids she tutored were stuid athletes, ergo, Wakka is stupid?
renayorama (10:37:41 PM): XD
zanydoodles (10:37:52 PM): well ... I want to react to it.
renayorama (10:38:09 PM): You can react to ME :-D
zanydoodles (10:38:16 PM): first of all, it's not an apology, I think.
zanydoodles (10:38:23 PM): yeah, I'm not going to comment. not my business.
zanydoodles (10:38:33 PM): but it's not an apology, if I'm understanding the title correctly.
renayorama (10:38:54 PM): Nope.
renayorama (10:38:56 PM): Not at all
zanydoodles (10:39:03 PM): "Apologia", if I remember my classical, does not mean "apologyu" but a formal defense.
zanydoodles (10:39:20 PM): " a formal beliefe of one's beliefs or actions"
zanydoodles (10:39:26 PM): er. defense of.
renayorama (10:39:44 PM): Sounds abou right
zanydoodles (10:40:31 PM): misleading, though. bothers em a little.
zanydoodles (10:40:35 PM): oh well.
zanydoodles (10:40:44 PM): I do take... well... not offense, I guess. I just. don't understand.
renayorama (10:40:51 PM): Welcome to Ikon-land
zanydoodles (10:40:51 PM): her experience with athletes was subpar.
renayorama (10:40:59 PM): I promised to read DSHND
zanydoodles (10:41:02 PM): ergo, athletes are dumb. and/or don't care about education.
renayorama (10:41:05 PM): Which KJ co-wrote
zanydoodles (10:41:09 PM): excuse me, but I'm an athelte.
renayorama (10:41:14 PM): With Ikon
renayorama (10:41:17 PM): I HATE Ikon's writing
renayorama (10:41:32 PM): NOOJ IS THE GREATEST CHARACTER EVER and oh look at these others yeah whatever
zanydoodles (10:41:40 PM): and also, I like to think, and intellectual. I love learnign for its own sake. I'm taking enough classes to TRIPLE MAJOR at one of the hardest schools in the country.
renayorama (10:41:45 PM): >.>
renayorama (10:41:49 PM): YUOU ARE CRAZY
zanydoodles (10:41:55 PM): AND AN ATHELETE
zanydoodles (10:41:59 PM): I AM DUMB D=
renayorama (10:42:00 PM): XD
zanydoodles (10:42:03 PM): NO COLELGE DEGREE FOR ME
zanydoodles (10:42:23 PM): I certianly ain't doing too good with the spelling, though!
renayorama (10:42:43 PM): XD
renayorama (10:42:48 PM): OH, FANDOM
renayorama (10:42:51 PM): I don't know
zanydoodles (10:42:53 PM): I...
renayorama (10:42:54 PM): KJ likes her.
zanydoodles (10:43:10 PM): I think what I find most... unpleasant... about what I glean of ehr from this entry is that...
renayorama (10:43:12 PM): And I trust KJ when she says Ikon isn't a bad person.
renayorama (10:43:19 PM): Just. Not so good with PEOPLE.
zanydoodles (10:43:24 PM): she takes traits that *I* have and..
zanydoodles (10:43:27 PM): makes them..
zanydoodles (10:43:34 PM): she's elitist about them. or SOUNDS elitist.
renayorama (10:43:41 PM): Hoyeah
zanydoodles (10:43:52 PM): like, the thing about vocabulary?
zanydoodles (10:43:54 PM): archaic words?
zanydoodles (10:43:58 PM): I love that, oh yes.
zanydoodles (10:44:04 PM): but I try not to wave it in people's faces, either.
zanydoodles (10:44:08 PM): it's not for THEM. it's for ME.
zanydoodles (10:44:17 PM): I like words for ME, not to show that off to others
zanydoodles (10:44:54 PM): "So please do not think I am proud of my scant skills and despise those who do not share them. If there is one thing I hold to in my life it is my honour. I do not lie. I will be silent rather than lie. So, when I tell you I am in awe of those who can do things which are beyond me - you may believe it."
zanydoodles (10:45:22 PM): well, based on what you say KJ thinks and on my general giving-people-the-benefit-of-the-doubt policy (whcih I fail at a lot), I'll buy this.
zanydoodles (10:45:26 PM): but lady, if this is true...
zanydoodles (10:45:31 PM): you have major social skill problems -_-
zanydoodles (10:45:40 PM): because that's exactly how you come off.
renayorama (10:46:01 PM): >.>
renayorama (10:46:08 PM): I had to like
renayorama (10:46:12 PM): Make an agreement with KJ
renayorama (10:46:19 PM): That I would leave reviews for DSHND
renayorama (10:46:36 PM): And I would decide, which each review I left, whether or not I wanted Ikon to read them
zanydoodles (10:46:38 PM): you're not an athlete, by your own admission, and see no merit in their skills. which I do believe ARE skills. and yet you bash them mercilessly and look down at them because they don't share your view or taste for intellect.
renayorama (10:46:47 PM): Because she is MEAN to reviewers
zanydoodles (10:46:55 PM): WHAT.
renayorama (10:46:56 PM): XD
zanydoodles (10:46:58 PM): nonononono
renayorama (10:47:00 PM): Logic go boom?
zanydoodles (10:47:05 PM): you WORSHIP reviewers.
renayorama (10:47:07 PM): HA
renayorama (10:47:09 PM): Not likely
zanydoodles (10:47:10 PM): you don't BEAT THEM
zanydoodles (10:47:26 PM): someone goes out of the way to review your story, you are GRATEFUL.
zanydoodles (10:47:47 PM): wow
zanydoodles (10:47:54 PM): Ikon has made me feel dirty for being kind of like her.
zanydoodles (10:48:00 PM): and for once upona  time having been MORE like her.
zanydoodles (10:48:21 PM): I really think she doesn't mean to hurt people. but just. she's failing.
renayorama (10:48:47 PM): A lot
renayorama (10:48:59 PM): I always wondered how exactly she and Kim got TOGETHER
renayorama (10:49:00 PM): Like
renayorama (10:49:01 PM): WHAT
renayorama (10:49:04 PM): uh
zanydoodles (10:49:28 PM): well, uh
zanydoodles (10:49:41 PM): unless one of us has more useful input... cna we change subjects? ;_;
zanydoodles (10:49:44 PM): this is depressing
renayorama (10:49:57 PM): You kept talking., >>
zanydoodles (10:50:00 PM): I'm the one who went off on this tangent so dman hard, but now I want to go home, please
renayorama (10:50:00 PM): But ye
renayorama (10:50:04 PM): yes we can
zanydoodles (10:50:19 PM): yeah, I was trying to understand what the hell was going on
zanydoodles (10:50:24 PM): now I do and wish I didn't
renayorama (10:50:26 PM): Craziness.
zanydoodles (10:50:27 PM): so, uh!
zanydoodles (10:50:33 PM): FFIX? Avatar? Other?
renayorama (10:50:34 PM): I did reviews? :-D
renayorama (10:50:38 PM): THEY WERRE GOOD
zanydoodles (10:50:46 PM): I saw!
renayorama (10:50:45 PM): You should read some of them. ;___;
renayorama (10:51:01 PM): Like, the stories
renayorama (10:51:05 PM): Not just the reviews. xD
zanydoodles (10:51:11 PM): yes, I understand
zanydoodles (10:51:15 PM): I will!
zanydoodles (10:51:22 PM): some sound very interesting. some sound spoilery!
renayorama (10:51:28 PM): XD
renayorama (10:51:36 PM): My reviews are full of spoilers, sorry
zanydoodles (10:52:13 PM): it's okay, I hve auto-spoiler gloss, remember? XD
renayorama (10:52:17 PM): Yeah. xD
renayorama (10:52:19 PM): SUPER POWER
renayorama (10:52:22 PM): ff_100 is going okay
renayorama (10:52:27 PM): Except for dude is
renayorama (10:52:31 PM): Not good.
renayorama (10:52:49 PM): He didn't say one kind thing to ANY of the writers
zanydoodles (10:52:52 PM): ooh, I need to check in over there!
zanydoodles (10:53:03 PM): I'm slowly slipping back into all my duties
zanydoodles (10:53:08 PM): poor ff100 got neglected!
renayorama (10:53:08 PM): XD
renayorama (10:53:11 PM): Duties!
renayorama (10:53:15 PM): It's going okay
renayorama (10:53:19 PM): I need to work on memories
zanydoodles (10:53:56 PM): ooh, hey, FFVIII!
zanydoodles (10:53:57 PM): uh
zanydoodles (10:54:16 PM): well, hey, what the heck, let's try popping it in the PS1 and see if it loads XD
renayorama (10:54:28 PM): >.>!!!!!!!!!
renayorama (10:54:35 PM): IF IT DOESN'T. D:
zanydoodles (10:54:54 PM): if it doesn't I'll take my PS1 to the shop XD
zanydoodles (10:57:08 PM): oh god
zanydoodles (10:57:09 PM): I
zanydoodles (10:57:13 PM): I forgot..
zanydoodles (10:57:20 PM): how HOT those black and white stills are
renayorama (10:57:22 PM): ....you forgot what
renayorama (10:57:23 PM): OH
renayorama (10:57:23 PM): XD
renayorama (10:57:24 PM): YES
zanydoodles (10:57:30 PM): OH JESUS.
zanydoodles (10:57:32 PM): uh
zanydoodles (10:57:34 PM): I need to like.
zanydoodles (10:57:42 PM): get hi-res shots of those and put them on my walls.
renayorama (10:57:53 PM): XD
renayorama (10:57:57 PM): Pretty!
zanydoodles (10:57:59 PM): how are such completely innocent, nonsexual shots so HOT.
zanydoodles (10:58:02 PM): it's the CROPPING.
zanydoodles (10:58:10 PM): I SWEAR IT'S THE CROPPING
renayorama (10:58:43 PM): Seifer's is my favorite
renayorama (10:59:03 PM): Totally unrelated question in which I ask advice:
renayorama (10:59:26 PM): I do reviews of pretty much, uh. Every story I read.
renayorama (10:59:35 PM): I don't know how to handle ff_100
zanydoodles (10:59:38 PM): which is YAY.
zanydoodles (10:59:44 PM): oh!
zanydoodles (10:59:45 PM): uh
renayorama (10:59:47 PM): Yeah.
zanydoodles (10:59:48 PM): HM
renayorama (10:59:50 PM): I own it.
renayorama (10:59:55 PM): Well, co-own.
zanydoodles (11:00:01 PM): do you leave comments on all the entries? honest ones?
zanydoodles (11:00:06 PM): (I HAVEN'T BEEN PULLING MY WIEGHT)
renayorama (11:00:15 PM): Well, I mean, not so far, leaving feedback
zanydoodles (11:00:19 PM): (I kind of coulsn't, though -- not my fandoms! right???)
renayorama (11:00:25 PM): I'm just talking about my reviews.
zanydoodles (11:00:53 PM): well. I think at the very least... maybe you shouldn't review without leaving comments?
renayorama (11:00:54 PM): I'm not going to be as candid on the community with people I dodn't know.
renayorama (11:01:07 PM): Like, I know how a lot of people will handle concrit
renayorama (11:01:15 PM): Some? I don't.
zanydoodles (11:01:18 PM): because then if they find negative things in reviews, they might feel like you couldn't say it to their face?
renayorama (11:01:27 PM): Something like that
renayorama (11:01:39 PM): I don't know how to balance.
zanydoodles (11:01:43 PM): well, um. I suggest trying to include most criticism you'd have in your review, but worded much more gently, in comments?
renayorama (11:01:58 PM): Yeah.
renayorama (11:02:00 PM): Probably
zanydoodles (11:02:05 PM): people who are known to ber very sensitive to criticism, maybe not touch them at all, in either way?
renayorama (11:02:12 PM): Well, no
renayorama (11:02:19 PM): If I read it, I review it
renayorama (11:02:27 PM): They published it, I'm not coddling them
renayorama (11:02:37 PM): I just don't want to run people off of the community
zanydoodles (11:02:44 PM): well...
renayorama (11:02:56 PM): On the OFF chance they might find my reviews
renayorama (11:03:04 PM): My journal IS kind of buried.
zanydoodles (11:03:11 PM): true
renayorama (11:03:14 PM): Ho ho ho
renayorama (11:03:20 PM): *CLEVER!*
zanydoodles (11:03:38 PM): well... if you will review everything, then... hm
zanydoodles (11:03:54 PM): how often DO you leave comments?
renayorama (11:03:54 PM): Mostly because I am FULL OF WORDS.
renayorama (11:04:00 PM): So far? Not much
renayorama (11:04:03 PM): I've had a backlog
renayorama (11:04:11 PM): Since I JUST started like
renayorama (11:04:14 PM): Reading/reviewing again
zanydoodles (11:04:25 PM): yes, I noticed
zanydoodles (11:04:33 PM): I should have waited to reveal my stories until now XD
renayorama (11:04:37 PM): XD
renayorama (11:04:42 PM): I have some of the links
renayorama (11:04:46 PM): They're in my OP section
zanydoodles (11:05:24 PM): ;-)http://justira.livejournal.com/183644.html
renayorama (11:05:48 PM): XD
renayorama (11:05:52 PM): You're on the ball
renayorama (11:06:01 PM): I don't have many others ut you
zanydoodles (11:06:17 PM): ut?
renayorama (11:06:17 PM): So it might be a REVIEW IRA day
renayorama (11:06:20 PM): but, sorry
zanydoodles (11:06:31 PM): I think, uh
zanydoodles (11:06:37 PM): if it were review me day I would DIE OF GLEE
zanydoodles (11:06:41 PM): and possibly of FLEE, too.
renayorama (11:07:11 PM): XD
renayorama (11:07:12 PM): BOTH
renayorama (11:07:18 PM): And they even rhyme
zanydoodles (11:07:27 PM): I know XD
zanydoodles (11:07:34 PM): GOD my in-progress list terrfies me.
zanydoodles (11:08:12 PM): Particularly, I've worked out bits of the Franky/Robin fic... whish is meant to be mroe speculation/UST than actual pairing
zanydoodles (11:08:23 PM): and I ahve my perfect opporunity, in the last chapters, for Iceburg/Robin fic
zanydoodles (11:08:25 PM): god, Oda
zanydoodles (11:08:27 PM): how I love you.
zanydoodles (11:08:34 PM): he fed me the perfect scenario for Iceburg/Robin
zanydoodles (11:08:38 PM): my secret het obession.
renayorama (11:09:10 PM): blark? xD
renayorama (11:09:19 PM): I haven't been reading
renayorama (11:09:22 PM): I am a slacker
zanydoodles (11:09:34 PM): I only did because I picked up the Vine
zanydoodles (11:09:41 PM): they got a new ship.
zanydoodles (11:09:51 PM): also, Franky was naked for most of the chapter.
zanydoodles (11:09:57 PM): seriously. his speedo got stolen.
renayorama (11:10:54 PM): ....QA
renayorama (11:10:55 PM): SWFDQAEFV[KOWRG
zanydoodles (11:11:15 PM): XD
zanydoodles (11:12:07 PM): Oda's crack is the best kind, surely
zanydoodles (11:12:09 PM): anyway, uh
zanydoodles (11:12:19 PM): yeah. so, uh. you will review OP fics soon?
renayorama (11:12:34 PM): Yeah
zanydoodles (11:12:39 PM): if you need more to read, I think I have a couple mroe I was meaning to rec...
renayorama (11:12:42 PM): XD
zanydoodles (11:12:52 PM): but I can't wait. how often do you review?
renayorama (11:13:14 PM): When I feel like it?
zanydoodles (11:13:29 PM): good policy XD
zanydoodles (11:14:15 PM): well, let me know if/when it happens. I'll die on the spot
zanydoodles (11:14:21 PM): you feel up to Avatar discussion?
zanydoodles (11:14:28 PM): there's commenting in the comm!
renayorama (11:14:31 PM): Uh
renayorama (11:14:35 PM): I could read?
renayorama (11:14:39 PM): I'm pretty mad, though
renayorama (11:14:51 PM): I'm sick of them yanking me around with Zuko.
renayorama (11:14:56 PM): Like
renayorama (11:14:58 PM): Way sick
zanydoodles (11:15:04 PM): understandably.
zanydoodles (11:15:17 PM): I live and breathe this kind of stuff, so while I'm very angry, I'm also revelling in it
renayorama (11:15:27 PM): I'm just angry
renayorama (11:15:32 PM): Aas.
zanydoodles (11:15:38 PM): well, not Avatar, then
zanydoodles (11:15:39 PM): FFIX?
renayorama (11:15:47 PM): I can listen!
renayorama (11:16:00 PM): Still remember about 0%! D
renayorama (11:16:12 PM): Basically, I fail at all discussion topics. Ever.
renayorama (11:16:18 PM): Like, I realized.
renayorama (11:16:23 PM): I don't remember anything about IX
renayorama (11:16:30 PM): I forgot characters.
renayorama (11:16:45 PM): It's been like five years. xD
renayorama (11:16:53 PM): I need to play it again.
renayorama (11:16:58 PM): To even do a discussion justice.
zanydoodles (11:17:09 PM): would a plot summary help?
zanydoodles (11:17:20 PM): I want to make my fic work ;_;
renayorama (11:17:35 PM): I don't know, I might have to go read a script.
renayorama (11:17:50 PM): I would hate to give you really crappy advice
zanydoodles (11:17:56 PM): full script is LONG. I downloaded one. over400 pages ;_;
renayorama (11:18:00 PM): ...oh
renayorama (11:18:02 PM): well
renayorama (11:18:04 PM): hmm
zanydoodles (11:18:13 PM): that's FULL script, though
renayorama (11:18:13 PM): Because I was thinking about your story
zanydoodles (11:18:17 PM): NPC fdialogue and all
zanydoodles (11:18:20 PM): what!
renayorama (11:18:20 PM): I don't even know where you are.
renayorama (11:18:23 PM): Like
zanydoodles (11:18:25 PM): oh XD
renayorama (11:18:27 PM): This place, where you're at?
renayorama (11:18:30 PM): Where IS that?
zanydoodles (11:18:32 PM): Oeilvert?
renayorama (11:18:37 PM): Because I don't remember it, period.
renayorama (11:18:51 PM): Maybe I didn't go there?
zanydoodles (11:18:55 PM): you did
zanydoodles (11:19:03 PM): part of the story, can't avoid it
renayorama (11:19:05 PM): Ah
zanydoodles (11:19:06 PM): iut's a short part, though
renayorama (11:19:06 PM): WELL
renayorama (11:19:08 PM): That seals it
renayorama (11:19:11 PM): 0%
zanydoodles (11:19:28 PM): I spent a lot of time levelling there, and I was also very struck by the atmosphere. most people wouldn't notice it as much as I did, I think
zanydoodles (11:19:57 PM): well, um
zanydoodles (11:20:17 PM): okay, I am mostly trying to discuss Zidane, Steiner, Freya, and AMarant in this story
zanydoodles (11:20:38 PM): and Oeilvert doesn't matter so much if you read the script for it -- that's like... less than 10 lines of dialogue, I think
zanydoodles (11:20:56 PM): so mabe a quick plot summary, Oeilvert script, and remembering what those four characters are like...?
zanydoodles (11:21:00 PM): if not, I'll um
zanydoodles (11:21:07 PM): do something else >.>
renayorama (11:21:57 PM): I remember the characters
renayorama (11:22:02 PM): That's not the problem
renayorama (11:22:11 PM): I don't really get what the place is
renayorama (11:22:14 PM): Or why you're there.
zanydoodles (11:22:30 PM): plot summary will explain!
zanydoodles (11:22:39 PM): hold on, I'm marshalling my forces!
zanydoodles (11:23:57 PM): wikipedia can helpt with the plot?
zanydoodles (11:23:59 PM): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FFIX#Plot
zanydoodles (11:25:16 PM): although that summary omits Oeilvert entirely. Oh! Wikipedia. Still, glosses over the game pretty quickyl.
zanydoodles (11:26:39 PM): script: http://db.gamefaqs.com/console/psx/file/final_fantasy_ix_script_a.txt
zanydoodles (11:26:51 PM): Oeilvert is serachble via OV01
zanydoodles (11:26:59 PM): you might want to read the...
zanydoodles (11:27:21 PM): three or so sections before that, though?
zanydoodles (11:27:41 PM): well, Desert Palace and Oeilvert, and probably the one after as well
zanydoodles (11:27:57 PM): Black Mage Village is not necessary for my story but helpful inremember overall plot details
renayorama (11:28:24 PM): *blink*
renayorama (11:28:37 PM): Does the black mage village have anything to do wirh your story?
renayorama (11:28:46 PM): I mean, I REMEMBER the plot. xD
renayorama (11:28:54 PM): *not that bad*
zanydoodles (11:28:57 PM): not directly, no. Vivi plays a small part, though, and it matters to him
renayorama (11:28:57 PM): I DID play the game
renayorama (11:29:04 PM): Hmm
renayorama (11:29:06 PM): Decisions
zanydoodles (11:29:20 PM): well, you didn't remember Oeilvert, so I wasn't sure what other details you  might have forgotten?
zanydoodles (11:29:37 PM): since they go to the Village, learn where Kuja is, get trapped by Kuja, and Zidane is forced to go to Oeilvert.
renayorama (11:29:49 PM): Well, I want to kind of not spoil ALL the stuff I've forgotten
renayorama (11:29:57 PM): Searching script!
zanydoodles (11:30:55 PM): yeah, that's why I tried to limit the sections
zanydoodles (11:31:05 PM): so you would still have replay value left XD
renayorama (11:32:45 PM): Okay, so
zanydoodles (11:33:45 PM): ..yes? >.>
renayorama (11:37:24 PM): Reading!
zanydoodles (11:37:47 PM): ah! I thought youw ere about to Pass Some Kind of Judgement
renayorama (11:38:47 PM): Oh
renayorama (11:38:48 PM): No?
renayorama (11:38:53 PM): OKAY I am caught up
zanydoodles (11:39:43 PM): yay =D
zanydoodles (11:40:19 PM): I, uh. Have discovered that the end of the game is somewhat useful, too. Do you remember it?
renayorama (11:40:33 PM): Kuja ans Zidane talk
renayorama (11:40:36 PM): About something
zanydoodles (11:41:20 PM): XD
zanydoodles (11:41:25 PM): I mean all the vaguer stuff
zanydoodles (11:41:34 PM): about memory and life and death
zanydoodles (11:41:37 PM): that stuff XD
renayorama (11:41:47 PM): Nope.
zanydoodles (11:43:03 PM): oh well. it's. um. very thematically related >.>
renayorama (11:43:11 PM): ._.
zanydoodles (11:43:21 PM): well, as long as you're passing familair, I think it's okay?
renayorama (11:43:25 PM): I fail at helping with stories.
zanydoodles (11:43:28 PM): I just... nee to make sure I *have* a plot >.<
renayorama (11:43:29 PM): Because I am a slacker
zanydoodles (11:43:31 PM): I fail at plot
zanydoodles (11:43:47 PM): no you're not. you just have different priorities.
renayorama (11:43:53 PM): Like
renayorama (11:43:54 PM): Sitting
renayorama (11:44:03 PM): And not finishing FFXII
renayorama (11:44:04 PM): >>
zanydoodles (11:45:07 PM): I always dawdle at the end of a game XD
renayorama (11:45:28 PM): When it's OVER.
renayorama (11:45:31 PM): I'm just saying
renayorama (11:45:33 PM): >>
renayorama (11:45:41 PM): The wait for revenant wings begins
zanydoodles (11:46:08 PM): XD
renayorama (11:46:08 PM): But I'm pretty sure you HAVE a plot
renayorama (11:46:21 PM): On the basis you need me to know all this stuff to understand it. xD
zanydoodles (11:47:07 PM): well, uh
zanydoodles (11:47:21 PM): I have trouble in shorter stories in understanding the difference between developing a theme and having a plot
zanydoodles (11:47:37 PM): theoritcally you USE plot TO develop themes, right?
renayorama (11:47:44 PM): Plot is...point a to b?
renayorama (11:47:47 PM): I would THINK so
zanydoodles (11:48:11 PM): well, okay, uh
zanydoodles (11:48:19 PM): so, I guess uh
zanydoodles (11:48:22 PM): I will plunge right in!
zanydoodles (11:48:26 PM): Oeilvert!
zanydoodles (11:48:29 PM): creepy abandoned place
zanydoodles (11:48:37 PM): creepy things Zidane half-remembers in there
zanydoodles (11:48:41 PM): and CREEPY enemies
zanydoodles (11:48:54 PM): do you remember what I said about the epitaph enemies in there?
renayorama (11:49:06 PM): Yeah
renayorama (11:49:11 PM): They sounded creepy
zanydoodles (11:49:12 PM): they basically ARE my plot so, uh, I can explain again if you forgot the one conversationw e had like a month ago XD
zanydoodles (11:49:46 PM): so, uh
zanydoodles (11:49:53 PM): I have three themes I want to touch on a lot?
renayorama (11:50:11 PM): Three of them: GO
zanydoodles (11:50:23 PM): the first is about, um. friendship, temawork. understanding going alone AND asking for help. Zidane has ISSUES with this.
zanydoodles (11:50:27 PM): all four of them do, actually.
zanydoodles (11:50:54 PM): Zidane preaches so much about friendship and teamwork, but he ahs this propensity to, when things get really bad, push his friends away and insist on going alone.
zanydoodles (11:51:05 PM): meanwhile, he continually urges Dagger to accept and understand help from others
zanydoodles (11:51:38 PM): Freya's problem seems to be blaming herself too much, I think.
zanydoodles (11:51:49 PM): Amarant just doesn't get this temwork/friendship business, though he learns
zanydoodles (11:52:32 PM): Steiner is, I think, actually the best at it. He understands accepting help, delegating tasks/responsibilities, and balancing doing things himself with working with others.
zanydoodles (11:53:03 PM): so, I wanted to work with that a lot. um. let me get my outline... >.>
renayorama (11:53:20 PM): He would have to be the best, considering he's not fond of Zidane towards the beginning. xD
zanydoodles (11:53:29 PM): he's a commander!
zanydoodles (11:53:45 PM): he's a knight commander, and I gather he actually worked his way up through the ranks.
zanydoodles (11:54:00 PM): he's supposed to be good at it, even though he's utterly hilarious.
renayorama (11:54:13 PM): XD
zanydoodles (11:54:38 PM): anyway
zanydoodles (11:54:43 PM): I want to highlight that, I thin
zanydoodles (11:54:46 PM): about Steiner
zanydoodles (11:54:54 PM): I think his skill at his job is underappreciated
zanydoodles (11:55:00 PM): he's far from stupid, he's just silly.
zanydoodles (11:55:14 PM): he was actually the first to realize who Vivi was and how pwoerful he was
zanydoodles (11:55:44 PM): and practically the first thing he did when it became eviednt that they'd be working together is devise a combat trick to combine their strengths -- for Vivi to enchant his sword.
renayorama (11:55:53 PM): SMRT
zanydoodles (11:55:57 PM): he also nails the Zidane/Dagger thing very early. possibly first.
zanydoodles (11:56:31 PM): anyway, I adore Steiner
zanydoodles (11:56:34 PM): MOVING ON XD
zanydoodles (11:56:47 PM): that was the first theme
zanydoodles (11:57:14 PM): second theme is, um. identity? sentience? clones, constructs, independent will
renayorama (11:57:24 PM): *blink*
renayorama (11:57:27 PM): That's ONE theme?
zanydoodles (11:57:42 PM): it's all related and I can't find one word for it -_-
zanydoodles (11:57:44 PM): free will?
zanydoodles (11:57:57 PM): hard to explain. it's the things that come out of the epitaphs. how they're different from, say, Vivi or the black mages.
zanydoodles (11:58:02 PM): Or Zidane and the genomes.
renayorama (11:58:52 PM): Ah. I see.
zanydoodles (11:59:12 PM): they're a good opportunity to play off that thread that runbs throughout the game.
zanydoodles (11:59:46 PM): I wonder if Vivi would have tried to talk to them >.>
zanydoodles (12:00:19 AM): anyway, so... this theme is kind of weird. it's tied to memory the way I'm thinking of it, I think. I'll explain that part later >.>
zanydoodles (12:00:28 AM): I always fail at explaining stories before I write them XD
renayorama (12:01:47 AM): X
renayorama (12:01:52 AM): I think I get it
zanydoodles (12:01:56 AM): and last is... hm. maybe not a theme. a motif, maybe. a set of related motifs, or related in this case. Mind, mirrors, and death. basically, Oeilvert and the epitaphs in a nutshell. the place plays with your mind, the epitaphs breed mirrors of you and you see yourself reflected and you die, staring them in the eye. creepy.
zanydoodles (12:02:00 AM): yeah, motif.
zanydoodles (12:02:04 AM): not solid/connected enough for a them
zanydoodles (12:02:09 AM): just something that comes up a lot.
zanydoodles (12:02:14 AM): ANYWAY.
zanydoodles (12:03:05 AM): I ahve to admit beforehand -- I'm also taking this opportunity to translate game mechancis (like potions, phoenix downs, and dying and tents and such) into narrative
zanydoodles (12:03:41 AM): so, um. that should be fun. Cause I have Freya die.
renayorama (12:04:40 AM): WHA
zanydoodles (12:04:55 AM): she's revived, it's okay >.>
zanydoodles (12:05:29 AM): that's why I said, game mechanics. should be interesting. I'm not sure if "die" is the correct term.
zanydoodles (12:05:44 AM): kocked out, maybe. whatever happens when you encounter your doppelganger
zanydoodles (12:05:51 AM): in the game, it actually says, DEAD.
zanydoodles (12:06:11 AM): the things don't hit you for a certain amount of damage. they come at you and instead of little numbers, you get DEATH.
renayorama (12:06:26 AM): Whoa
zanydoodles (12:07:02 AM): so, yeah. an epitaphs mimics Freya, she dies (or whatever), panic ensues, they stop with the local moogle in a tent for a while. I'm pretending phoenix down actually takes, you know. TIME AND EFFORT to work >.>
zanydoodles (12:07:08 AM): THAT'S NOT THE PLOT >.<
zanydoodles (12:07:16 AM): that's something that happens. in the middle.
renayorama (12:07:43 AM): No, that's cool
renayorama (12:07:47 AM): Something happens!
zanydoodles (12:08:03 AM): yes, stuff happens! PLOT: they arrive at Oeilvert!
zanydoodles (12:08:11 AM): it opens creepily before them.
zanydoodles (12:09:04 AM): they explore enough for Zidane to start half-remembering stuff, and also encounter their first epitaph. I think I want it to spit out Quina.
zanydoodles (12:09:45 AM): so that at first they're way confused and don't understand, and also Quina's speech pattern is unique. I also wanted to save most of the others for later.
zanydoodles (12:10:26 AM): so, yeah. they defeat the thing. by the way, epitaphs never actually attack on their own, they just send doppelgangers, but they DO cast petrify.
zanydoodles (12:10:29 AM): another enat trick of theirs.
zanydoodles (12:10:32 AM): anyway.
zanydoodles (12:11:04 AM): they continue on to a second epitaph. this one spits out Freya, and she dies. we're actually IN Freya's POV for this part.
zanydoodles (12:11:32 AM): I did want to go into the way epitaphs kill people like that, and I thought Freya was a good candidate... I think the self-doubt attarcted me.
zanydoodles (12:12:35 AM): I wanted to get into her self-doubt and other related problems, how she doesn't deal with failure well. picking her for the dying seemed natural?
zanydoodles (12:13:15 AM): anyway, she dies. panic ensues. Amarant demonstrated possible UST of the sort hinted at in the game. hobag. They hastily do the phoenix down thng and then set up a tent with the local moogle.
zanydoodles (12:13:22 AM): I insist of having the moogle participate XD
zanydoodles (12:13:39 AM): and while Freya recovers, Zidane starts having some disturbing thoughts
zanydoodles (12:14:09 AM): I want to take this opportunity, the lull, to have them all interact together before Zidane has his thought thing
zanydoodles (12:14:27 AM): (elaboration on thought thing later)
zanydoodles (12:14:50 AM): anyway, Freya recovers, they're all a little shaken, but keep going because their friends are back with Kuja
zanydoodles (12:15:22 AM): we go through the rest of the memories the place holds, and Zidane thinks a lot about his past (or lack thereoef) and what Oeilvert might hold for him, since he feels a connection to the place
zanydoodles (12:16:04 AM): it's... I think oeilvert is the first reference to Terra he ever encounters.
zanydoodles (12:16:14 AM): I want to exploit this.
renayorama (12:16:40 AM): Epxloit?
zanydoodles (12:16:52 AM): yes
renayorama (12:17:01 AM): How so?
zanydoodles (12:17:07 AM): tyoing, typing!
zanydoodles (12:17:47 AM): I want him to think about why he remembers strange things here, why it seems familiar. he used to search for his own past, a little obsessively. he stopped, and now he suddenly stumbles on Oeilvert
zanydoodles (12:18:02 AM): well, not stumble. by that I mean, he wasn't LOOKING for his past anymore -- it found him
zanydoodles (12:19:58 AM): he remembers Freya's doppelganger and kind of has a moment where he wonders if he found an epitaph, if the Zidane that came, would it remember more than he did? would that make it more real? (except put this in Zidane-speak, with less overt wangst. although MY GOD can that boy wangst when he wants to!)
zanydoodles (12:20:56 AM): he thinks about Vivi, too, and wonders about how sentient the doppelgangers are, when they all encounter another one and it mimics Vivi.
zanydoodles (12:21:35 AM): and I am tired of explaining. Wrapping up in a hurry.
zanydoodles (12:22:39 AM): they deal with it, move on, Zidane's mind wanders to Dagger, when they encounter a doppelganger of HER. and at this point, as I recall, Dagger can't talk.
renayorama (12:23:01 AM): Can't talk?
zanydoodles (12:23:15 AM): yeah, she goes mute for most of the third disc
zanydoodles (12:23:43 AM): or like half of it or something.
zanydoodles (12:24:04 AM): out of grief for Alexandria, or shock, or enchantment. I couldn't tell, and should look it up again.
zanydoodles (12:24:10 AM): might have been intentionally ambiguous
zanydoodles (12:24:57 AM): anyway, Dagger can't talk, but the doppelganger does (they always shout "I am ___!"), and that kind of snaps him out of wondering about them and confirms what he'd been thinking about -- Oeilvert is watching him.
zanydoodles (12:25:20 AM): because every time, the thing that came out of the epitaph was the person he was thinking about.
zanydoodles (12:25:56 AM): to me, this would be creepy >.>
renayorama (12:26:06 AM): Just a LOT
zanydoodles (12:28:22 AM): so until they reach Ark (final boss here), Zidane kind of tries to purposefully keep his mind off his friend and just concentrate on himself. because he doesn't want anyone else to die like Freya did. possibly it would also be awkward if he managed to mix a doppelganger up with the real thing. he also is angry, I think. he's fighting Oeilvert on his own, now. his friends are THERE and they'd help if he explained, but he doesn't.
zanydoodles (12:28:26 AM): becuase he thinks it's His Problem
zanydoodles (12:28:55 AM): they seem largely unaffected byt he place (not true -- they ARE affected, just less so, and this ties to the unviersal memory themes from the end of the game)
zanydoodles (12:29:03 AM): so he kind of... takes Oeilvert personally.
zanydoodles (12:29:37 AM): this part of the story came about mostly because the epitaphs when I played just KEPT COPYIGN ZIDANE.
zanydoodles (12:29:39 AM): OH MY GOD.
zanydoodles (12:29:57 AM): fortunately, if you're quick enough, you can kill them in one move before they kill their duplicates.
renayorama (12:30:02 AM): Ah
renayorama (12:30:08 AM): Hmm!
renayorama (12:30:10 AM): MEMORY
renayorama (12:30:20 AM): Seems like you like dealing with memories. >D
zanydoodles (12:30:25 AM): yes >>>
renayorama (12:30:31 AM): *COUGHAXELCOUGH*
zanydoodles (12:30:37 AM): XDDD
zanydoodles (12:30:42 AM): I'llget to him, too XD
zanydoodles (12:30:46 AM): just, uh. not in this story.
zanydoodles (12:30:55 AM): what is it about blondes who lose their memory??
zanydoodles (12:31:25 AM): anyway, I kind of wanted to set it up for some semi-forced Zidane introspection, to help set up WHY he's such a butthead at the end of the game.
zanydoodles (12:31:32 AM): and kind of point out that flaw he has
zanydoodles (12:32:10 AM): "blah blah blah TEAMWORK blah blah blah FRIENDSHIP blah blah blah ACCEPT HELP FROM FRIENDS blah blah blah OH LOOK, SOMETHING I TAKE PERSONALLY. WATCH EM HARE OFF AND REFUSE ANY AND ALL AID!"
zanydoodles (12:32:26 AM): Zidane, you idioy -_-
zanydoodles (12:32:30 AM): t
zanydoodles (12:33:18 AM): so that's the... central conflict, I guess. Zidane's personal struggle with Oeilvert, and along the way, I want to use the idea of memory to point out that he's wrong, and at the same time to help him come to his conclusions.
zanydoodles (12:33:28 AM): this is elaving out most of the inter-character interaction, though
zanydoodles (12:33:44 AM): cause Steiner, Amarant, and Freya don't actually disappear from the story >.>
zanydoodles (12:34:32 AM): they each have roles to play and I ahve these conversations planned and for some reason I really want Steiner and Freya to interact >.>
zanydoodles (12:35:14 AM): I have a chat for them as Freya recovers while Zidane's off thinking and Amarants skulks acting all independent >.>
renayorama (12:35:33 AM): XD
zanydoodles (12:35:36 AM): anyway. that was a brief outline, mostly Zidane-centric. He only takes up abpout... half the narrative, though, I think.
renayorama (12:35:45 AM): It sounds INTERESTING
zanydoodles (12:35:56 AM): the rest is Oeilvert/omniscient, and the other three in the party.
zanydoodles (12:36:07 AM): DOES THAT SOUND LIKE PLOT???
renayorama (12:36:53 AM): YES
zanydoodles (12:37:00 AM): I'm ahving trouble telling because I feel like I'm focusing too much on what I wanty to talk ABOUT rather than how I want to move the story along. also, I want it to have a plot INDEPENDENT of the plot for that snippet of the game. Not a... noveliation, you know?
renayorama (12:37:14 AM): Yeah.
renayorama (12:37:18 AM): Hard to do, possibly?
zanydoodles (12:37:22 AM): I wanted to make sure it had a conflict that wasn't the same one used in the game. use the game's conflict as BACKDROP, not center.
zanydoodles (12:37:48 AM): so yeah, that's why it makes me nervous
zanydoodles (12:38:35 AM): I'm havign a blast with trying to make it all creepy and doing description and trying tog et a handle on third person omniscient and playing with game mechanics and getting EVERYONE to talk to EVERYONE ELSE, I was, uj. vrey nervous that I was leaving something importnat out.
zanydoodles (12:38:37 AM): like, say.
zanydoodles (12:38:39 AM): a POINT.
zanydoodles (12:38:42 AM): >.>
zanydoodles (12:39:26 AM): briefly, the main point is that Zidane is a butthead about this particular issue. minor points about Freya's self-doubt and Amarant's scorn for friendship are made, and also Steiner and his opinion of Zidane.
zanydoodles (12:40:12 AM): Steiner is too well-balanced. I couldn't see what to prod him about other than his low opinion of Zidane and the Zidane/Dagger thing. I might want to revise for something better for him; I don't want to cheat him.
zanydoodles (12:40:53 AM): Steiner is... I have a hard time getting ahandle on him.
zanydoodles (12:41:27 AM): he SEEMS really silly sometimes, with the clanking and the jumping up and down and stuff, but I actually can't think of a huge... Issue for him, I guess.
zanydoodles (12:41:45 AM): not just in this story, I eman
zanydoodles (12:41:47 AM): in general.
zanydoodles (12:41:51 AM): am I missing something?
renayorama (12:42:15 AM): I don't think so
renayorama (12:42:22 AM): He's pretty straight-forward
renayorama (12:42:24 AM): Honor, maybe?
renayorama (12:42:29 AM): He IS a knight. >.>
zanydoodles (12:42:35 AM): like... his little character profile/catchphrase is "Having sworn fealty, must I spend my life in servitude?"
zanydoodles (12:42:47 AM): and his catchword MIGHT be honour, I don't remember
zanydoodles (12:43:12 AM): Freya's phrase is, appropriately enough for my purpose, "To be forgotten is worse than death"
zanydoodles (12:43:17 AM): memory and detah all in one, excellent
zanydoodles (12:43:32 AM): wow, typos left right and enter tonight
zanydoodles (12:44:12 AM): anyway, there just... I don't think I can do much for Steiner in my story besides have him interact with others and maybe revise his opinion of Zidane a little.
zanydoodles (12:44:20 AM): I don't want to force it if the setup just isn't there.
zanydoodles (12:45:04 AM): Steiner already ahd his big moment of honour, when he chose to go back and fight with Freya and Beatrix instead of running away with the others. it's not that his conflict is all said and done by this point, it's just that it's... less relevant?
zanydoodles (12:45:11 AM): anyway, um
zanydoodles (12:45:17 AM): there it went >.>
zanydoodles (12:45:22 AM): sound like it could be.. okay?
renayorama (12:45:24 AM): Yeah
renayorama (12:45:27 AM): I want to read it
renayorama (12:45:34 AM): EVEN REMEMBERING NOTHING. XD
zanydoodles (12:45:59 AM): XD
zanydoodles (12:46:02 AM): well, um!
zanydoodles (12:46:04 AM): good!
zanydoodles (12:46:15 AM): I am reassured that my story has a point!
zanydoodles (12:46:37 AM): I have talked about it for A SOLID HOUR.
renayorama (12:48:39 AM): You must really need to write it
renayorama (12:48:40 AM): LIKE
renayorama (12:48:42 AM): Soon!
zanydoodles (12:49:00 AM): is this for your benefit or mine?
zanydoodles (12:49:10 AM): and I AM writing it. I have snippets all over the place.
zanydoodles (12:49:17 AM): like Freya's detah, I wrote that already >.>
zanydoodles (12:50:18 AM): death. I can't type tonight. typing too fast.
zanydoodles (12:50:32 AM): APPARENTLY I want to get back into fandom. I can't stop talkign about FANDOM STUFF.
zanydoodles (12:52:09 AM): I just.
zanydoodles (12:52:16 AM): KUJA HAS SUCH WIDE CHILDBEARING HIPS
zanydoodles (12:52:17 AM): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Kuja.JPG
zanydoodles (12:59:01 AM): ...poke?
renayorama (1:05:11 AM): SO LAME
renayorama (1:05:38 AM): On TWO levels
zanydoodles (1:05:47 AM): ...?
renayorama (1:05:57 AM): #1 - internet died
renayorama (1:06:04 AM): #2 - new roommate SUCKS
renayorama (1:06:19 AM): and is leaving and not coming back
zanydoodles (1:06:21 AM): who IS this new roommate??
renayorama (1:06:24 AM): Stupid kid
renayorama (1:06:27 AM): Good riddance
zanydoodles (1:06:33 AM): and would you like me to resend what I was talking about?
renayorama (1:06:39 AM): Yes, please.
zanydoodles (1:06:49 AM): when did he get there? and who is he and what the heck is he doing>
zanydoodles (1:06:50 AM): ?
renayorama (1:06:57 AM): A few weeks ago?
zanydoodles (1:07:06 AM): renayorama (12:48:39 AM):You must really need to write it

renayorama
(12:48:40 AM):LIKE

renayorama
(12:48:42 AM):Soon!

zanydoodles
(12:49:00 AM):is this for your benefit or mine?

zanydoodles (12:49:10 AM):and I AM writing it. I have snippets all over the place.

zanydoodles (12:49:17 AM):like Freya's detah, I wrote that already >.>

zanydoodles (12:50:18 AM):death. I can't type tonight. typing too fast.
renayorama (1:07:14 AM): Matt met him on the internet, his mom was abusive, Matt invited him here
zanydoodles (1:07:15 AM): zanydoodles (12:50:32 AM):APPARENTLY I want to get back into fandom. I can't stop talkign about FANDOM STUFF.

zanydoodles (12:52:09 AM):I just.

zanydoodles (12:52:16 AM):KUJA HAS SUCH WIDE CHILDBEARING HIPS

zanydoodles (12:52:17 AM):http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Kuja.JPG

zanydoodles (12:59:01 AM):...poke?

renayorama (1:05:11 AM):SO LAME
renayorama (1:07:33 AM): He came, he's done nothing but stay in Matt's room
renayorama (1:08:08 AM): Apparently, his mom is harassing his friends back home, so they're taking her to court
renayorama (1:08:15 AM): And he has to go back home to testify
renayorama (1:08:25 AM): GOD, white trash, I wish you would stay out of my life
renayorama (1:08:34 AM): This is the second false roommate we've had, you see.
renayorama (1:08:58 AM): number one was Zach's brother, who came and then decided TRUE LOVE was more important and moved back home.
zanydoodles (1:09:04 AM): false roommate? was this one expected to pay rent?
renayorama (1:09:14 AM): Yes.
zanydoodles (1:09:18 AM): huh!
zanydoodles (1:09:21 AM): very lame indeed!
renayorama (1:09:25 AM): So this is TWICE now
renayorama (1:09:29 AM): TWICE
renayorama (1:09:36 AM): This has happened
zanydoodles (1:09:40 AM): yeah, pretty annoying =\
renayorama (1:09:40 AM): No more roommates.
renayorama (1:09:46 AM): Unless I know them
renayorama (1:09:48 AM): Period.
zanydoodles (1:10:18 AM): usually a good policy
renayorama (1:10:56 AM): Like
renayorama (1:11:01 AM): I TRUSTED Matt on this
renayorama (1:11:20 AM): I'm so private, anyway, and getting used to him here was bothersome enough.
renayorama (1:11:54 AM): Now he's leaving so I'll have to get used to THAT.
renayorama (1:12:16 AM): Lame, lame, lame. Lame.
zanydoodles (1:12:47 AM): possibly why I will never have roommates >.>
zanydoodles (1:12:57 AM): only one I ever had is Travis
zanydoodles (1:13:12 AM): the one I had in college doesn't count, cause Reed generally has divided doubles
zanydoodles (1:13:17 AM): eahc person gets their own little room
zanydoodles (1:13:26 AM): but only one person ahs a door out into the hall
zanydoodles (1:14:28 AM): hey, um
zanydoodles (1:14:38 AM): after y FFIX catharsis I feel like maybe time for bed >.>
renayorama (1:15:27 AM): Okay! Sorry I ranted.
renayorama (1:15:28 AM): Just.
renayorama (1:15:33 AM): Disaapointed and angry.
renayorama (1:15:47 AM): Back to financial troubles, yay.
zanydoodles (1:16:27 AM): no, I don't mind!
zanydoodles (1:16:35 AM): I actually feel bad cause it looks like I'm bailing
zanydoodles (1:16:39 AM): I'm just exhausted
zanydoodles (1:16:46 AM): long week, and I just talked for an hour staright. LAME.
zanydoodles (1:16:58 AM): go thwap Matt upside the head for this, though.
renayorama (1:17:11 AM): Oh.
renayorama (1:17:13 AM): NO WORRIES.
renayorama (1:17:18 AM): No worries at all.
renayorama (1:17:22 AM): Sleep well! :-D
zanydoodles (1:18:10 AM): you too, whenever you get around to it!
zanydoodles (1:18:14 AM): THANKS FOR LISTENING.
zanydoodles (1:18:21 AM): I'm sorry I fail at summarizing plots ;_______________-;
renayorama (1:19:23 AM): I WILL PLAY SOON
renayorama (1:19:26 AM): :-D
zanydoodles (1:20:37 AM): well, I meant MY plots, but game plots too!
renayorama (1:22:47 AM): XD
zanydoodles (1:23:00 AM): FALLING ASLEEP
zanydoodles (1:23:04 AM): g'night, sleep well
renayorama (1:23:57 AM): Night!
renayorama signed off at 2:44:31 AM.
renayorama signed on at 7:29:16 AM.
renayorama signed off at 7:31:24 AM.
renayorama signed on at 8:42:09 AM.
renayorama went away at 9:37:17 AM.
renayorama returned at 6:41:19 PM.
renayorama (6:41:56 PM): WOE
renayorama (6:42:27 PM): Too much sleep. >.>
zanydoodles (1:22:19 AM): poke?
renayorama (1:22:32 AM): poke! POKE POKE

Auto Response from zanydoodles (1:22:36 AM): SLEEP
renayorama (1:22:38 AM): *POUNCE*
renayorama (1:23:30 AM): Ooops
renayorama (1:23:33 AM): I uh
renayorama (1:23:40 AM): Was kind of excited, there
zanydoodles (1:24:09 AM): it's okay XD
zanydoodles (1:24:22 AM): are you all right? I saw your lj entry earlier
zanydoodles (1:24:24 AM): what the hell??
renayorama (1:24:30 AM): Uh
renayorama (1:24:35 AM): Kids are lame
zanydoodles (1:25:24 AM): kida?
zanydoodles (1:25:33 AM): A kid said that?
renayorama (1:25:35 AM): Uh
renayorama (1:25:36 AM): Yeah
renayorama (1:25:41 AM): I mean, I know he's full of crap
renayorama (1:25:44 AM): My writing doesn't suck
renayorama (1:26:16 AM): But who TELLS someone they don't like their writing, and then when the writer asks for suggestions, goes into a rant about how theyll NEVER EVER be better and they suck
renayorama (1:26:17 AM): Ahem
zanydoodles (1:26:39 AM): ... WHAT
zanydoodles (1:28:03 AM): ...how old was this kid, what the heck were his parents DOING all that time, and what the hell is his problem?
renayorama (1:28:58 AM): 18 or so?
renayorama (1:29:04 AM): I don't know. o.o
renayorama (1:29:09 AM): I guess he's uh
renayorama (1:29:12 AM): Jealous?
renayorama (1:29:33 AM): And I'm supposed to write Larxene and Namine, but with torture
renayorama (1:29:37 AM): HALP
zanydoodles (1:29:48 AM): whoa, what?
zanydoodles (1:29:50 AM): is that a, uh
zanydoodles (1:29:52 AM): gift?
renayorama (1:29:57 AM): Yees. .___.
renayorama (1:30:01 AM): Well, a request
renayorama (1:30:22 AM): I need to rewatch CoM. >D
zanydoodles (1:30:29 AM): Larxene looks like the more psychological torture type than the physical >.>
zanydoodles (1:31:43 AM): she seems to like saying mean things, but I don't know that she'd... huh. I don't know. she strikes me like the type who'd enjoy undercutting Namina's already fragile esteem, but seeing actually physically hurting her as... not exactly beneath her but maybe less fun?
zanydoodles (1:32:52 AM): Or, well, not... fancy torture, I guess. uh. I'm not sure I want to go into detail with you because this covnersation could get very disturbing very fast >>>
renayorama (1:32:57 AM): >.>
renayorama (1:33:05 AM): But hey
renayorama (1:33:10 AM): VERBAL torture
renayorama (1:33:20 AM): (he mentioned sadism, BUT I'M NOT TOUCHING IT)
zanydoodles (1:33:30 AM): he?
zanydoodles (1:33:39 AM): same person? I hope not!
zanydoodles (1:34:00 AM): and, by the way, you don't have to get physical to be a sadist.
renayorama (1:34:10 AM): (I don't understand it, is all)
zanydoodles (1:34:14 AM): you just have to like hurting people, and there are many, many ways to do that without laying a figner on them.
renayorama (1:34:22 AM): Like a lot of the things like that
renayorama (1:34:26 AM): I don't fully understand them
renayorama (1:34:32 AM): And I'm not really--it's 100 words!
zanydoodles (1:34:34 AM): what do you mean?
renayorama (1:34:44 AM): Like, I don't know much because they freak me out
renayorama (1:34:53 AM): I like happy stuff. .__.
zanydoodles (1:34:59 AM): well, you know I have a taste for the morbid XD
zanydoodles (1:35:26 AM): I like strange weird dirdty psychological stuff
zanydoodles (1:35:33 AM): but hey, if it's a drabble, maybe easier.
zanydoodles (1:37:06 AM): Namine has these brief little sparks of rebellion in her, even early on. she's usually pretty timid, but I can see Larxene bantering with her as usual, being her mean smiling self, until Namine softly says something that actually manages to hit a sore spot with her, and if you want anything physical, that's probably when -- I xould see Larxene losing control a little when playing with her victim is suddenly Not Funny. slap or one-hand chokehold or something.
renayorama (1:37:33 AM): >.>
renayorama (1:38:25 AM): I wish I would clever enough with the "self"
renayorama (1:38:38 AM): You know, "somebody" and "nobody" and things like that
zanydoodles (1:38:47 AM): she has power over lightning too, right? a small shock might be believable, too, if that's what the guy wanted. I see Larxene as more of a warning type than using full strength outside of strue battle
zanydoodles (1:39:07 AM): yeah, somebody/nobody would be a good subject, I guess>
zanydoodles (1:39:08 AM): ?
zanydoodles (1:39:36 AM): I don't know, I don't know who this is for. I'm just trying to think of scenarios/reactions that would fit the theme and be simple enough for 100 words =\
renayorama (1:39:41 AM): I mean, just in general
renayorama (1:39:46 AM): How a lot of authors play with the concept
renayorama (1:39:51 AM): I am JEALOUS
zanydoodles (1:39:55 AM): oh yeah, I love that.
renayorama (1:40:00 AM): Namine seems...not RESIGNED
renayorama (1:40:15 AM): But she's a Nobody that (to me) sought to get BACK to her Other
renayorama (1:40:17 AM): Is that wrong?
zanydoodles (1:40:40 AM): more so than anyone in the Oganization, surely.
zanydoodles (1:41:07 AM): they mostly seemed completely disinterested in their Others, but then again, most of their Others wouldn't actually be around, huh?
zanydoodles (1:41:15 AM): Ansem, Sora, and Kairi were all special cases.
renayorama (1:41:22 AM): They'd have become heartless, yes
renayorama (1:41:24 AM): ?
zanydoodles (1:41:32 AM): yeah
renayorama (1:42:14 AM): So possibly uh
renayorama (1:42:16 AM): VANQUISHED?
zanydoodles (1:42:29 AM): ?
renayorama (1:42:33 AM): Like, OKAY
renayorama (1:42:43 AM): *SPOILS PART OF HER AWESOME E-MAIL*
renayorama (1:42:55 AM): There is a person
zanydoodles (1:43:08 AM): (actually... this makes Roxas and Namine a bit of a paradox -- all the Nobodies call them even LESS than Nobodies, but I think they are also MORE, because their Others still exist...)
renayorama (1:43:14 AM): Uh, something happens.
renayorama (1:43:30 AM): Person splits to a heartless and a Nobody (if their heart is strong enough?)
zanydoodles (1:43:33 AM): awesome email = KH EMAIL OF DOOM???
renayorama (1:43:45 AM): Yeah
renayorama (1:43:54 AM): Almost done!
zanydoodles (1:43:56 AM): yes, I think so. Only if they're strong enough, hence fewer Nobodies than Heartless, and they're generally more powerful
zanydoodles (1:44:04 AM): OMG I WANT IT
renayorama (1:44:12 AM): But if they were strong enough, would they have split anyway?
zanydoodles (1:44:19 AM): eh??
renayorama (1:44:35 AM): If someone's heart was strong enough to become a Nobody
renayorama (1:44:42 AM): Why would darkness have uh
renayorama (1:44:44 AM): GOT'EM
renayorama (1:44:47 AM): Pounced
zanydoodles (1:44:57 AM): well, think Riku.
zanydoodles (1:45:03 AM): they could have intentionally given in.
zanydoodles (1:45:22 AM): or Sora.
zanydoodles (1:45:27 AM): he became a Heartless voluntarily.
zanydoodles (1:45:33 AM): uh. weirdly, but voluntarily.
renayorama (1:45:51 AM): So how does that apply to say, Axel!
zanydoodles (1:46:25 AM): Ansem, too, sought darkness specifically. Kairi... I think of the three exceptions she might be most applicable here, since she theoretically HAD no darkness in her heart, being a Princess
zanydoodles (1:46:28 AM): she was just... swallowed.
zanydoodles (1:46:33 AM): when her world died.
zanydoodles (1:46:51 AM): as for Axel, uh
zanydoodles (1:47:05 AM): we're going into the area where I've been speculating for my big fic about him XD
zanydoodles (1:47:38 AM): unfortunately for the poor guy I've mostly been focusing on Roxas' admittedly more pressing relationship with HIS Other.
zanydoodles (1:48:09 AM): hold on, let me check canon for something. meanwhile, um. any reaction to what I've been saying so far? >.>
renayorama (1:48:35 AM): No, Kairi makes sense, which is why I kind of like Namine
renayorama (1:49:18 AM): It KIND OF bunnies me for Namine fic, because of all of them I would think, we, she WANTS to get back with her Other.
renayorama (1:49:36 AM): Whereas like, Roxas...it seems...like he wants to meet Sora?
renayorama (1:49:40 AM): But he's his own person
zanydoodles (1:49:58 AM): they both are.
zanydoodles (1:50:06 AM): Namine and Roxas.
renayorama (1:50:21 AM): He doesnt want to go back
zanydoodles (1:50:53 AM): Also, I am now confused about KH canon (apparently, completely normal state of being) becuase I can't remember if people with exceptionally strong hearts became Nobodies or just... "strong" or meaning "strong character" or what. .______.
zanydoodles (1:51:14 AM): no, Roxas wants to be himself, not.. um. assimilate with Sora. I think.
zanydoodles (1:51:26 AM): I was just saying that both namine and Roxas are their own people.
renayorama (1:51:32 AM): Yeah.
renayorama (1:51:34 AM): They are!
renayorama (1:51:43 AM): I just find Namine interesting that way
zanydoodles (1:51:49 AM): yes, she is
renayorama (1:52:00 AM): Anyway, I HAD A POINT OMG WHERE IS IT.
zanydoodles (1:52:15 AM): it's easy to see her as really bland, but I don't think she actually is. just quiet.
renayorama (1:52:30 AM): Talking about the Heartless born from the people who became Nobodies
zanydoodles (1:52:38 AM): yes.
renayorama (1:52:40 AM): And being uh, vanquished
zanydoodles (1:52:51 AM): yeah, the vanquished really lost me
zanydoodles (1:52:52 AM): what?
renayorama (1:52:55 AM): When you kill a heartless, doesnt a little heart float up?
zanydoodles (1:53:09 AM): yep.
renayorama (1:53:29 AM): And the whole GAME in KH the bigger plot was that Xemnas was using Sora
renayorama (1:53:39 AM): Which is revealed in KH2
zanydoodles (1:53:41 AM): KH2, yeah
renayorama (1:54:02 AM): Were they planning to go to Kingdom Hearts and find their heart? .>
zanydoodles (1:54:20 AM): I don't... hm...
renayorama (1:54:26 AM): I dont know!
zanydoodles (1:54:31 AM): give me a moment on that, I'm trying to recall canon
renayorama (1:54:30 AM): *is just wondering*
zanydoodles (1:54:49 AM): but in other news, I had a cute thought. "The enemy of my enemy is my friend" DID NOT apply here.
zanydoodles (1:55:19 AM): hm.
zanydoodles (1:55:32 AM): I... am a little confused about Kingdom Hearts.
renayorama (1:55:49 AM): So
zanydoodles (1:55:53 AM): because in KH 1, I thought the big door they go through so much trouble to close was the door to kingdom hearts?
renayorama (1:55:53 AM): We're in the same boat.
renayorama (1:56:04 AM): They closed the door.
renayorama (1:56:06 AM): Locked it
zanydoodles (1:56:12 AM): but there were heartless inside. Big ones. possibly like the darkness in every heart, maybe?
renayorama (1:56:19 AM): Yeah.
zanydoodles (1:56:26 AM): but in KH2, kingdom hearts is apparently a BIG HEART HSPAED MOON.
zanydoodles (1:56:34 AM): is it an artificial kingdom hearts?
zanydoodles (1:56:38 AM): lump enough little hearts together?
renayorama (1:56:43 AM): A door appears
zanydoodles (1:56:45 AM): I WAS VERY CONFUSED.
zanydoodles (1:56:51 AM): yes.
renayorama (1:56:52 AM): When the trio is together
renayorama (1:56:59 AM): They can unlock the door
zanydoodles (1:57:09 AM): BIT WHAT ABOUT THE DAMN MOON :____________;
renayorama (1:57:08 AM): I thought it was like sort of a
renayorama (1:57:13 AM): Bastardized door
renayorama (1:57:20 AM): For the Nobodies
zanydoodles (1:57:23 AM): artiificial back door?
renayorama (1:57:24 AM): Yeah
renayorama (1:57:26 AM): Like that
zanydoodles (1:57:34 AM): created using the power of the big moon...?
zanydoodles (1:57:42 AM): summoned, kind of? CONFUSED.
renayorama (1:57:50 AM): YEAH. GEEZ, KH WRITERS.
renayorama (1:57:52 AM): WHAT THE HECK
zanydoodles (1:58:05 AM): OKAY LET'S ASSUME IT MAKES SENSE.
zanydoodles (1:58:48 AM): so, um. the Nobodies collect hearts so they can use the collective power to make a door to Kingdom Hearts.
zanydoodles (1:59:26 AM): I... THINK they actually said they wanted the power of KH to become complete humans?
zanydoodles (1:59:54 AM): I don't know if they mean by finding the specific heart that used to be theirs, or just by, um. using the Magical Powers of KH >.>
renayorama (2:00:03 AM): XD
zanydoodles (2:01:09 AM): KH IS CONFUSING ._____.
renayorama (2:01:14 AM): I KNOW
renayorama (2:01:21 AM): And CoM is WORSE
zanydoodles (2:01:25 AM): good opportunities for meta, but still. BRAIN HUTR ;_________;
renayorama (2:01:27 AM): and KH2 EVER WORSE THAN THAT
zanydoodles (2:01:36 AM): well, by KH I meant the entire series.
zanydoodles (2:01:40 AM): HALP
zanydoodles (2:02:30 AM): ....
renayorama (2:02:32 AM): HALP HALP
zanydoodles (2:02:37 AM): you said my email was nearing completiong? >.>
zanydoodles (2:02:38 AM): <.<
zanydoodles (2:02:38 AM): >.>
zanydoodles (2:04:30 AM): oh, and, um, geez, I didn't mean to stay this long. I just meant to get online to make sure you were okay >.>
renayorama (2:04:50 AM): Ooosp
renayorama (2:04:51 AM): UM
zanydoodles (2:04:53 AM): I think I need to go, but might come back in a couple hours? If not I tanked out somewhere >.>
renayorama (2:04:53 AM): SORRY
zanydoodles (2:05:03 AM): oh, I don't mind, it's my fault!
renayorama (2:05:15 AM): XD
renayorama (2:05:18 AM): Thanks, though!
zanydoodles (2:05:22 AM): anyway, I have to go for now, okay?
renayorama (2:05:23 AM): Okay!
renayorama (2:05:26 AM): See you later. :-D :d
zanydoodles (2:05:30 AM): yes =D
zanydoodles (2:05:32 AM): bye for now!
renayorama (8:56:52 AM): WHY ARE YOU NOT AWAKE
renayorama (8:57:03 AM): WHY HAVE YOU NOT FORCED ME TO CATCH UP ON ONE PIECE
renayorama (8:57:08 AM): WHY WHY WHY OMG HILARITY
renayorama (9:08:22 AM): HILARIOUS EXCHANGE (maybe?)
renayorama (9:08:43 AM): joethesockpuppet: shounen manga DOES things to you
joethesockpuppet: ahaha, i'll allow it!
renayorama: LIKE RIP OUT YOUR HEART AND GEAR SECOND IT TO DEATH
renayorama: JUST SAYING
renayorama went away at 11:54:38 AM.
renayorama returned at 9:13:55 PM.
renayorama (9:19:28 PM): I'm awake at all the times you are asleep. >D
zanydoodles (9:25:04 PM): I haven't been asleep, mostly, just busy
zanydoodles (9:25:07 PM): still am, actually
renayorama (9:25:09 PM): Oh.
zanydoodles (9:25:12 PM): filing insurance claims -__
renayorama (9:25:12 PM): Ooops.
renayorama (9:25:24 PM): Sorry. >.>
zanydoodles (9:25:31 PM): nah, it's okay
zanydoodles (9:25:38 PM): I'm having a flurry of adulthood. it sucks XD
zanydoodles (9:25:53 PM): anyway, once the family goes to bed they'll leave me alone and then I can come back here for a bit
renayorama (9:25:55 PM): Okay!
zanydoodles (9:26:25 PM): yeah. for now, more grownup stuff. blech >XP
renayorama (9:26:52 PM): GROSS
zanydoodles (9:27:03 PM): I KNOW
zanydoodles (9:27:07 PM): I'LL GET GROWNUP COOTIES
renayorama (9:28:26 PM): EW
zanydoodles (9:29:02 PM): anyway, I gotta go for a bit, but ina  couple hours the family will eb asleep and I will sneak back to my secret dark desires.
renayorama went idle at 11:12:58 PM.
renayorama returned at 11:13:15 PM.
renayorama went away at 11:43:24 PM.
renayorama (12:42:19 AM): woe
renayorama returned at 1:31:23 AM.
renayorama (1:45:54 AM): You are not to return, I think!
renayorama went away at 7:48:10 AM.
renayorama returned at 8:48:24 AM.
renayorama signed off at 12:25:26 PM.
renayorama signed on at 9:49:12 PM.
renayorama (9:54:16 PM): *WEEPS*
renayorama (9:54:22 PM): ADULTHOOD STINKS
renayorama (9:54:49 PM): I want you to come back!
renayorama (9:54:52 PM): *sulks*
renayorama went idle at 5:49:51 AM.
renayorama returned at 5:52:34 AM.
renayorama went idle at 11:57:37 AM.
renayorama returned at 12:15:07 PM.
renayorama signed off at 1:44:55 PM.
renayorama signed on at 2:25:49 PM.
renayorama signed off at 2:26:16 PM.
renayorama signed on at 7:53:43 PM.
renayorama (7:55:57 PM): STILL SLEEPING
renayorama (7:56:00 PM): SLEEPING BEAUTY
zanydoodles (8:29:56 PM): I need to change that message >.>
zanydoodles (8:30:01 PM): I'm home, and eating at the moment
renayorama (8:30:11 PM): :-D HI!
zanydoodles (8:30:21 PM): hi =D
zanydoodles (8:31:03 PM): I'm eating, but I am GLAD this past week and a ha;lf is  over with
zanydoodles (8:31:07 PM): I CAN BE HUMAN AGAIN
renayorama (8:31:05 PM): ME TOO
renayorama (8:31:09 PM): YOU WERE EATEN
zanydoodles (8:31:13 PM): YAY
zanydoodles (8:31:40 PM): to celebrate, I went over my fic-in-progress list and plotted outlines for anything that didn't have one done yet and tweaked a few more. AHH.
zanydoodles (8:32:26 PM): tomorrow, an apology in my journal and back into fandom head-first
zanydoodles (8:32:33 PM): for now, though -- DINNER
zanydoodles (8:32:45 PM): I've been eating a meal and a half a day since I got home last week D=
renayorama (8:33:02 PM): YES
renayorama (8:33:03 PM): FOOD IS GOOD
zanydoodles (8:33:16 PM): INDEED
zanydoodles (8:33:33 PM): I might turn in early tonight but GOD. deadlines, over; Travis, on his way.
zanydoodles (8:33:35 PM): me, FREE
renayorama (8:33:49 PM): :-D
renayorama (8:39:21 PM): I AM FULL OF GLEE
renayorama (8:39:23 PM): YOU ARE BACK
renayorama (8:39:40 PM): That's good timing since very soon I'm going to word vomit about you
zanydoodles (8:49:18 PM): what >.>
zanydoodles (8:49:22 PM): (done with dinner)
zanydoodles (8:49:25 PM): about me?
renayorama (8:49:28 PM): Yes!
zanydoodles (8:49:32 PM): I thought I was supposed to edit somethign FOR you?
renayorama (8:49:34 PM): Well, not JUST you
renayorama (8:49:40 PM): My list is pretty extensive.
zanydoodles (8:49:46 PM): oh
zanydoodles (8:49:49 PM): good?
zanydoodles (8:49:51 PM): uh
zanydoodles (8:49:53 PM): what list? >.>
renayorama (8:50:06 PM): You are not in on my PLANS
renayorama (8:50:10 PM): You have been missing, sorry
zanydoodles (8:50:16 PM): uhoh
renayorama (8:50:15 PM): http://community.livejournal.com/bangonfic/14890.html
zanydoodles (8:50:18 PM): PLANS???
renayorama (8:50:22 PM): Well.
renayorama (8:50:25 PM): They were plans
renayorama (8:50:30 PM): Now they're action
zanydoodles (8:51:55 PM): uh
zanydoodles (8:52:00 PM): uh oh
renayorama (8:52:09 PM): What! What uh oh!
zanydoodles (8:52:48 PM): this looks to be embarassing!
renayorama (8:52:53 PM): XD
renayorama (8:52:59 PM): For you?
renayorama (8:53:01 PM): Yeah, probably
renayorama (8:53:04 PM): Watch me fawn!
zanydoodles (8:53:11 PM): note how many people have mentioned you!
renayorama (8:53:15 PM): GOD DON'T TALK ABOUT IT
renayorama (8:53:20 PM): I wish I could find people who like
renayorama (8:53:22 PM): DON'T KNOW ME
zanydoodles (8:53:45 PM): XD
zanydoodles (8:53:58 PM): hey, you alk about me, I talk about how much other people talk about YOU
zanydoodles (8:54:00 PM): ha!
zanydoodles (8:55:01 PM): hmmm... I might want to comment, maybe anonymously, but I don't feel I know many people that well D=
zanydoodles (8:55:06 PM): serves me right for being a hermit
renayorama (8:55:25 PM): *snicker*
renayorama (8:55:27 PM): You know me
renayorama (8:55:31 PM): *shoots self*
renayorama (8:55:50 PM): I can see your comment now
renayorama (8:56:17 PM): "This stupid girl got me ALL UP IN FANDOM NEWSLETTERS. THANKS A LOT, NAY. FOR NOTHIN'."
zanydoodles (8:56:26 PM): XD
renayorama (8:56:33 PM): Ooops
zanydoodles (8:57:12 PM): ... oh my LORD
zanydoodles (8:57:16 PM): you're doing these all TODAY?
renayorama (8:57:23 PM): Doing all what today?
zanydoodles (8:57:28 PM): oh god, should I go hide NOW?!?!?!?!?
renayorama (8:57:34 PM): Oh
renayorama (8:57:35 PM): >.>
renayorama (8:57:40 PM): I don't know when I'll finish
zanydoodles (8:57:47 PM): all your comments! this entry was made just-shy-of-midnight last night!
zanydoodles (8:57:54 PM): and it has been SWARMED by fandom love today!
zanydoodles (8:58:03 PM): which is, of course, excellent
zanydoodles (8:58:05 PM): just, uh. wow.
zanydoodles (8:59:14 PM): hmm, hmm, hmm... to post anonymously or not...
renayorama (8:59:45 PM): NO
renayorama (8:59:49 PM): Unless you want. ._.
zanydoodles (9:00:33 PM): oh. um. well, I'm still thinking. why the vehemenve, though, out of curiousity?
renayorama (9:00:48 PM): I don't want people to be scared anymore. >.>
zanydoodles (9:00:54 PM): *vehemence
renayorama (9:00:52 PM): Or shy
renayorama (9:00:55 PM): I guess
zanydoodles (9:01:13 PM): hm. well, I guess I can un-hermit for a moment.
zanydoodles (9:01:27 PM): is it just me or are my social tendencies very strange?
zanydoodles (9:01:57 PM): I'm pretty forthright and open in AIM, even with people I don't know well. I can adress the general public in LJ posts okay. but then I have HERMIT MOMENTS.
zanydoodles (9:02:12 PM): this is true of my offline life, too, by the way.
renayorama (9:02:24 PM): Maybe it's a sign
zanydoodles (9:02:29 PM): I largely avoid social setting with people I don't know VERY well, but sometimes I have weird social periods
zanydoodles (9:02:31 PM): a sign?
renayorama (9:03:49 PM): Of impending hermitude?
zanydoodles (9:04:05 PM): impending?
zanydoodles (9:04:11 PM): I've been this way all my life XD
zanydoodles (9:04:16 PM): I am actually much MROE social now.
zanydoodles (9:04:24 PM): more
renayorama (9:04:27 PM): CLEARLY I HAVE BEEN MISLED
renayorama (9:04:33 PM): Or just oblivious
renayorama (9:04:34 PM): That too
zanydoodles (9:05:03 PM): nah, you haven't had much opportunity to experience hermit-me directly\
zanydoodles (9:05:13 PM): I kind of barged into your life and mostly stayed there XD
renayorama (9:06:52 PM): Yeah. XD
renayorama (9:06:56 PM): HALF A YEAR
renayorama (9:07:27 PM): I hope I have a job by our anniversary, I'll have to buy something suitably embarrassing
renayorama (9:07:52 PM): Vibrating cucumbers, delivered via giant basket among other fruit and vegetables? CLEVER.
zanydoodles (9:08:18 PM): oh dear >.>
zanydoodles (9:08:32 PM): my conservative sexual mores are shocked.
zanydoodles (9:08:33 PM): shocked,
zanydoodles (9:08:49 PM): and possibly also dismayed and/or offended.
renayorama (9:09:34 PM): XD
renayorama (9:09:35 PM): Right
zanydoodles (9:09:57 PM): oh, yes. quite offended.
zanydoodles (9:10:18 PM): now you've piqued my egotistical curiousity. when do I get my comment? >.>
renayorama (9:10:32 PM): XD!
zanydoodles (9:10:39 PM): make no mistake. I have a HUGE ego. it's horrible. that's why I hide it >.>
renayorama (9:10:52 PM): You could read all MINE and borrow some of MY ego
renayorama (9:10:55 PM): IT'S LEAKING OUT EVERYWHERE
zanydoodles (9:11:16 PM): but I LIKE your ego XD
zanydoodles (9:11:25 PM): min's not very friendly. I keep it on a leash. in the doghouse.
zanydoodles (9:11:29 PM): underground.
zanydoodles (9:11:38 PM): in China.
renayorama (9:12:13 PM): I will post about you next!
renayorama (9:12:22 PM): But before that I'm BRINGING IT DOWN
renayorama (9:12:26 PM): And RUINING THE MOMENT
zanydoodles (9:12:32 PM): whut whut?
renayorama (9:12:31 PM): To complain
renayorama (9:12:37 PM): 'Cause that's what I do.
renayorama (9:12:48 PM): FANDOM JEALOUSY: HOW TO COMBAT
zanydoodles (9:12:55 PM): eh?
renayorama (9:13:02 PM): How to combat fandom jealousy.
renayorama (9:13:06 PM): Step #1: HALP.
zanydoodles (9:13:22 PM): fandom jealousy?
renayorama (9:13:22 PM): Yeah
zanydoodles (9:13:34 PM): jelousy of other fandoms or itner-fandom jelouasy?
renayorama (9:13:38 PM): In the last day, I have had discussions.
zanydoodles (9:13:43 PM): god, the typing -_-
renayorama (9:13:43 PM): That have all ended the same way
renayorama (9:14:02 PM): Nay says: I was talking to Ira blah blah whatever I said
renayorama (9:14:18 PM): Person says: I think she's KIND OF A KNOW-IT-ALL.
renayorama (9:14:36 PM): Nay says: WHAT THE HELL. *RANT RANT SIGN-OFF*
renayorama (9:15:06 PM): A day later, Nay says: Della is a real life editor! She sent me a review! She says I have what it takes! *me me me*
renayorama (9:15:23 PM): Person says: I avoid her! I think she avoids me! I don't see what's go great about her!
renayorama (9:15:30 PM): Nay says: ...
zanydoodles (9:15:38 PM): I'ma  know-it-all? >.>
renayorama (9:15:43 PM): Nay says: Can we get back to my EGO?
zanydoodles (9:15:47 PM): but... I don't know it all ;_;
renayorama (9:15:47 PM): No.
renayorama (9:15:48 PM): You're not.
renayorama (9:16:00 PM): That's why it's called jeousy
zanydoodles (9:16:05 PM): do I even know this person? ;_;
renayorama (9:16:05 PM): ...spelled correctly
renayorama (9:16:06 PM): Yes.
zanydoodles (9:16:34 PM): well! um. thank you for what sounds like defending me, I think?
zanydoodles (9:16:43 PM): weord though, what's up with this outbreak?
zanydoodles (9:17:14 PM): 1) If somene has a useful skill, try learning from them rather than seething in quiet (or not-so-quiet) jealousy
zanydoodles (9:17:28 PM): 2) You have a problem with somebody that might be fixable, you tell THEM, not their friend.
renayorama (9:17:36 PM): I didn't so much defend you as spaz out and rage
renayorama (9:17:57 PM): I had no words, except for "FUCK YOU!" and I don't think that would've helped anything.
zanydoodles (9:18:11 PM): possibly not!
zanydoodles (9:18:19 PM): although that can be very satisfying sometimes.
renayorama (9:18:34 PM): And earlier today I showed them the bangonfic post
renayorama (9:18:54 PM): And they were like "ho hum."
renayorama (9:19:03 PM): I'm like, "YOU'RE ALL OVER IT, WHY ARE YOU UNHAPPY!"
zanydoodles (9:19:08 PM): uh. is this someone I know well and consider a friend, or someone I know in passing? I'm trying to decide if I should be upset or shrug it off befor I get back to going O_O with you and trying to figure out what the hell is in the internets water lately
renayorama (9:19:25 PM): I don't know how much you and she talk. ._.
zanydoodles (9:20:40 PM): uh... well. I basically talk to you a lot, Kim sometimes/rarely. I used to talk to auronlu/Helluin over lj but haven't bumped into her lately. I used to talk to tairako a lot, too, but haven't seen her around much lately either.
zanydoodles (9:20:51 PM): muggy I think I've talked to a little?
zanydoodles (9:20:57 PM): honestly I fail at keeping track of people ._.
zanydoodles (9:21:17 PM): part of why I'm having difficulty with writing a comment of my own. I'm terrified of leaving someone out ._.
zanydoodles (9:22:22 PM): oh! outside ff fandom I know Amy.
zanydoodles (9:22:36 PM): and people in OP fandom who I'm not sure you talk to? >.>
renayorama (9:22:52 PM): If you do leave someone out, it's not like you can't comment again. ;-)
zanydoodles (9:23:00 PM): I fail at names/people ;__;
renayorama (9:23:02 PM): Well.
renayorama (9:23:09 PM): I don't want it to get back to her
zanydoodles (9:23:15 PM): well, I know. I'm debating just not doing names and keeping it general.
renayorama (9:23:19 PM): Because I'm still debating on if I want to say anything
renayorama (9:23:32 PM): You have to say MY name, as the Ego Monster demands it
renayorama (9:23:36 PM): *cackes*
renayorama (9:23:46 PM): Although, what do I say
renayorama (9:23:51 PM): "Stop being jealous of NOTHING?"
zanydoodles (9:24:01 PM): I'm... not too specifically worried about WHO, just whether I thought they were a close friend.
zanydoodles (9:24:52 PM): If they're not a good friend, I guess it would take too much energy to crusade in honour of my name. I'd rather people bothered to get to know me first, and if they still don't like me, then... not pretend to, I guess?
renayorama (9:25:38 PM): Well it makes me ad because you've like
renayorama (9:25:40 PM): GONE TO BAT
renayorama (9:25:44 PM): And BEEN SUPPORTIVE
renayorama (9:25:53 PM): And I am just like, *BOGGLE*
renayorama (9:26:22 PM): She later apologized to me specifically and said she was jealous, but she didn't take back what she had said.
renayorama (9:26:28 PM): SO I WAS ONLY HALF SATISFIED.
zanydoodles (9:27:08 PM): I'm starting to have Suspicions, which I wish I didn't because I don't want to wrongly suspect someone
zanydoodles (9:27:17 PM): also, this conversation wasn't supposed to eb about me, but I hijacked it D=
renayorama (9:28:18 PM): XD
renayorama (9:28:46 PM): You probably know, it's not like you haven't watched drama unfold recently!
zanydoodles (9:29:07 PM): I.... have?
renayorama (9:29:06 PM): I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO DO. Except maybe ignore it and hope it goes away.
renayorama (9:29:10 PM): *head in sand*
renayorama (9:29:29 PM): If you watched the KJ and Ikon and Kim Variety Hour
renayorama (9:29:31 PM): That was drama.
zanydoodles (9:29:45 PM): I was going to ask about the three recent drama s I remember
renayorama (9:29:46 PM): And I hate to say it, but KJ and Ikon didn't start it. ._.
zanydoodles (9:30:15 PM): that, regann, and the art critic
zanydoodles (9:30:22 PM): um. so. that leaves Kim ._.
zanydoodles (9:30:48 PM): what in the world did I DO to make her irate with me?
renayorama (9:31:16 PM): Nothing. ._.
zanydoodles (9:31:20 PM): if it was my opinion of the recent drama, and she was somehow upset by what I todl you, she would have gotten the exact same story out of me if she'd asked.
renayorama (9:31:44 PM): I guess you didn't fawn enough.
renayorama (9:31:46 PM): I don't know.
renayorama (9:31:58 PM): KJ and I are are afraid that everything in fandom has to come back to her.
zanydoodles (9:32:22 PM): well, okay, I admit to intellectual elitism. I said as much before. but I try to remember about the PEOPLE. I'm actually really grateful to know her. I was writing this about ehr in my thanks about her, that I was glad to talk to her because she kept my ehad on straight, whether she knew it or not.
renayorama (9:32:38 PM): And since you don't talk much
renayorama (9:32:43 PM): I guess it's me
renayorama (9:32:46 PM): My fault.
zanydoodles (9:32:52 PM): what.
zanydoodles (9:33:01 PM): where the hell did THAT come from?
renayorama (9:33:02 PM): She needs attention
renayorama (9:33:08 PM): I used to give her loads; I don't anymore
zanydoodles (9:33:22 PM): oh. um. I'm bad at attention.
renayorama (9:33:24 PM): I spend time NOT being angst-filled
renayorama (9:33:32 PM): And uh, drama llamaing it up
renayorama (9:33:52 PM): So I think when I talk about people I admire
renayorama (9:34:07 PM): She's dismissive or outright rude.
zanydoodles (9:34:22 PM): I'm not mad at her or anything, besides for not being able to call me on it if she thought I was doing something obnoxious. I just want to know where *I* went wrong.
zanydoodles (9:34:31 PM): well, it can be vrey difficult to listen to other people being praised.
zanydoodles (9:34:44 PM): there's always a little voice going BUT WHAT ABOUT MEEEEE inside.
renayorama (9:34:43 PM): Re: YOU, she was rude. She had to tangent to even make the point about what she thought of you, because we weren't even on the topic of YOU, we were talking about Ikon.
zanydoodles (9:34:53 PM): in me there is, at least, but I tell you, I'm a supressed egotist.
renayorama (9:35:05 PM): And because of thatI don't think it was about you, but to hurt me
zanydoodles (9:35:14 PM): well!
renayorama (9:35:15 PM): Because your opinion means a lot of me
zanydoodles (9:35:19 PM): that's not nice.
renayorama (9:35:24 PM): Just like when I was excited about Della reviewing my work
renayorama (9:35:33 PM): And I'll fangirl at you about that someday
zanydoodles (9:35:55 PM): well, be reassured -- I think highly of you, and you seem pretty acquainted with the fact that I'll talk straight to you, I hope.
renayorama (9:35:56 PM): I wanted to share it and she totally was like, "I don't like Della, I don't care about her opinion, why is she so great."
renayorama (9:36:06 PM): It wasn't about Della, it was about ME.
renayorama (9:36:23 PM): And someone actually involved in the publishing industry telling me "you are a GOOD WRITER."
zanydoodles (9:36:30 PM): (this is going to sound painfully obviously contrasting, but honestly: I want to hear about Della! I want to meet her!)
zanydoodles (9:36:45 PM): well. um. is she the only recent source of jealousy?
zanydoodles (9:37:00 PM): because then it's not a jealousy-problem, but a Kim-problem
zanydoodles (9:37:13 PM): there was that guy recently who was all badmouthing your writing?
renayorama (9:37:36 PM): He's a lame little kid.
renayorama (9:37:50 PM): I don't get any from anyone else but her.
zanydoodles (9:38:07 PM): well. huh
zanydoodles (9:38:22 PM): okay, please keep in mind that I fail at itnerpersonal relationships.
zanydoodles (9:38:38 PM): is this a recent thing? or is this an ongoing trait?
renayorama (9:38:53 PM): It's been recent
renayorama (9:38:59 PM): Since she became...not the fandom darling
renayorama (9:39:02 PM): You missed most of that
renayorama (9:39:14 PM): She was FLYING HIGH from March to August
renayorama (9:39:17 PM): Big Name
zanydoodles (9:40:10 PM): ah! well that can hit people hard, especially if they had any kind of self esteem issues before
zanydoodles (9:40:19 PM): I don't know about ehr on that count; I didn't know her then
zanydoodles (9:41:12 PM): I'm at a loss of what to say or do, though. I'm no expert on psychology and definitely not one on handling people. I at least took a CLASS in psychology >.>
zanydoodles (9:41:42 PM): my usual recommended approach is to just TALK to people when they develop obnoxious or distressing habits.
zanydoodles (9:41:49 PM): of course, this DOES NOT ALWAYS WORK ._.
renayorama (9:42:11 PM): >.>
renayorama (9:42:18 PM): Yeah.
renayorama (9:42:21 PM): I AM FULL OF WOE.
zanydoodles (9:43:47 PM): yeah. man, wow, I'm sorry.
renayorama (9:44:03 PM): I am bad at defense
renayorama (9:44:08 PM): I sort of just cower when she does it
zanydoodles (9:44:13 PM): um. lord. is there anything I can do? are you planning to say anything to her?
renayorama (9:44:15 PM): TOTALLY killed my review buzz
zanydoodles (9:44:21 PM): don't cower! cowering lessens you.
renayorama (9:44:40 PM): It's like, "hey this girl who is a REAL LIFE EDITOR! looked at my work! I am thrilled!"
renayorama (9:44:44 PM): And it becomes about her.
renayorama (9:44:50 PM): THAT IS PROBABLY THE WORST PART.
renayorama (9:45:09 PM): If it keeps up, I might say something.
zanydoodles (9:45:49 PM): well... let's hope she realizes and gets over the ebb in popularity. I hope she does, for both your sakes.
zanydoodles (9:45:54 PM): is there anything I can do in the meantime?
zanydoodles (9:46:02 PM): I'm lost here, I don't know what to say or do.
renayorama (9:47:25 PM): Nah!
renayorama (9:47:27 PM): I'M GOOD.
renayorama (9:47:38 PM): I can let you read something. >D
zanydoodles (9:48:17 PM): ooh? read?
renayorama (9:48:49 PM): The thing I wrote about you for bangonfic. >D
renayorama (9:50:01 PM): As I just posted it
renayorama (9:50:05 PM): Right this second
zanydoodles (9:50:20 PM): oh dear >.>
renayorama (9:50:24 PM): YOU ARE NOT ALLOWED TO FLEE
zanydoodles (9:50:35 PM): ...
renayorama (9:50:39 PM): It got kind of long
zanydoodles (9:50:42 PM): I am... creeping over in cringing curiousity
zanydoodles (9:50:45 PM): ... oh dear
zanydoodles (9:50:50 PM): maybe I WILL flee >.>
zanydoodles (9:50:56 PM): ... waiting for the page to laod while I decide
renayorama (9:51:29 PM): NO
zanydoodles (9:51:34 PM): oh dear
renayorama (9:51:33 PM): NO FLEEING ALLOWED
zanydoodles (9:51:46 PM): I changed your outlook? ._.
renayorama (9:51:52 PM): Just read. >D
zanydoodles (9:52:20 PM): I did
zanydoodles (9:52:22 PM): oh dear
zanydoodles (9:52:23 PM): um
renayorama (9:52:21 PM): Oh, typos
renayorama (9:52:27 PM): Wow, you are fast
zanydoodles (9:52:31 PM): Thank you very much
zanydoodles (9:53:00 PM): I am reading Della's now and I SERIOUSLY need to meet this woman.
zanydoodles (9:53:03 PM): she sounds AWESOME.
renayorama (9:53:26 PM): XD
renayorama (9:53:33 PM): She is, she is
zanydoodles (9:53:38 PM): straight-forwardness, seeing clear to the heart of things, and not to mention good editing skills are all things I aspire to.
zanydoodles (9:53:53 PM): and discussions on writing!
zanydoodles (9:54:13 PM): I think I am in internet-love!
zanydoodles (9:54:20 PM): (IT'S OKAY, I WOULD NEVER ABANDON YOU)
renayorama (9:54:39 PM): (THAT'S GOOD, BECAUSE I WOULD TOTALLY GET EVERTYTHING IN THE DIVORCE IF YOU TRIED)
zanydoodles (9:55:32 PM): XD
zanydoodles (9:55:46 PM): hmm. I meant to go back and comment on that thread about fandom/fic/writing.
zanydoodles (9:55:48 PM): maybe I should.
zanydoodles (9:55:57 PM): but hey, seriously.
zanydoodles (9:55:59 PM): thanks very much.
zanydoodles (9:56:05 PM): I'm astounded.
renayorama (9:56:27 PM): >>
renayorama (9:56:31 PM): WHY. xD
renayorama (9:56:42 PM): I'm like, THE PRESIDENT OF YOUR FAN CLUB
renayorama (9:58:36 PM): Wow
renayorama (9:58:41 PM): So I thought I was getting close to done
renayorama (9:58:43 PM): UM
renayorama (9:58:51 PM): Right, 12 people to go. >D
zanydoodles (9:59:07 PM): wow.
zanydoodles (9:59:15 PM): you have a lot of love to go around.
renayorama (9:59:17 PM): Uh
renayorama (9:59:23 PM): Is that bad? >>
zanydoodles (9:59:31 PM): that's... special.
zanydoodles (9:59:31 PM): in a good way.
renayorama (9:59:31 PM): I interact with a lot of people
zanydoodles (9:59:37 PM): not in a "THis is my 'special' cousin Tommy, don't worry if he chews the carpet a little" way
renayorama (9:59:42 PM): XD
renayorama (10:00:08 PM): So now that's I've done a little more word vomiting
renayorama (10:00:18 PM): I'll takea break and see if someone else will leave a comment. >.>
zanydoodles (10:01:58 PM): I am!
zanydoodles (10:02:05 PM): Mine feel inadequte, but I do mean it
renayorama (10:02:28 PM): Uh
renayorama (10:02:40 PM): I think we have realized I am much with the words.
renayorama (10:02:41 PM): I mean
renayorama (10:02:51 PM): I TALKED ABOUT MALARIA IN YOURS.
renayorama (10:02:53 PM): WHAT'S THAT
zanydoodles (10:03:24 PM): XD
zanydoodles (10:03:31 PM): it's okay, it was kind of relared!
renayorama (10:04:05 PM): I can;t decide if you mean "related" or "retarded"
zanydoodles (10:04:19 PM): ...
zanydoodles (10:04:30 PM): well, "both" would be a good answer but I MEANT related!
renayorama (10:04:40 PM): XD
zanydoodles (10:05:24 PM): I commented! I tried to keep the name-specific section very short because I am shy and scared
renayorama (10:05:29 PM): >.>
zanydoodles (10:05:46 PM): but.... please know, you mean a lot to me, even if I don't say it well. SO THERE.
renayorama (10:06:01 PM): WANNA MAKE OUT?
zanydoodles (10:06:10 PM): XD
renayorama (10:06:16 PM): *amuses self*
zanydoodles (10:06:28 PM): sadly, I don't seem to be into cyber.
zanydoodles (10:06:29 PM): OH WELL.
zanydoodles (10:06:35 PM): we can just write gay porn at each other.
zanydoodles (10:06:45 PM): that's kind of like making out with words, right?
renayorama (10:07:43 PM): XD
renayorama (10:07:46 PM): It's like RP
renayorama (10:07:51 PM): Where people write sex scenes
renayorama (10:08:02 PM): GUYZ. NOT FOOLING ANYONE.
zanydoodles (10:08:09 PM): yeah, uh
zanydoodles (10:08:20 PM): I am pretty convinced two people in OP fandoma ctually got together that way
renayorama (10:08:25 PM): *blink*
renayorama (10:08:27 PM): Huh!
renayorama (10:08:36 PM): I DON'T JUDGE
renayorama (10:08:42 PM): I just giggle like a 12 year old
zanydoodles (10:08:56 PM): yeah, uh. there was this big AU university rp and they did a lot of sex between their characters. and now I swear they're dating.
zanydoodles (10:09:02 PM): I don't think they'd ever met before.
renayorama (10:09:12 PM): Well
renayorama (10:09:13 PM): Kim did it
renayorama (10:09:20 PM): So I don't doubt it happens
zanydoodles (10:09:31 PM): it's okay. I like one of them a lot and the other one makes awesome art, so they can go internet-sex each other up all they want XD
renayorama (10:09:37 PM): Yeah
renayorama (10:09:43 PM): I'M FINE WITH IT
zanydoodles (10:10:17 PM): well, I'd be... um... not hypocritical, but SOMETHING if I judged them harshhly for it, seeing as I devoured their RPs for a while XD
zanydoodles (10:10:37 PM): possibly hypocritical, actually.
zanydoodles (10:10:46 PM): whatever, they have whatever fun they want
renayorama (10:11:31 PM): Hahaha
renayorama (10:11:34 PM): Della has uh
renayorama (10:11:35 PM): POSTED
zanydoodles (10:11:51 PM): here, have some Ace: http://yaoi.y-gallery.net/view/233403/ courtesy of one of the above
renayorama (10:12:30 PM): EXCELLENT
renayorama (10:12:50 PM): Ace <3
zanydoodles (10:13:13 PM): indeedy
renayorama (10:13:23 PM): Wow
renayorama (10:13:31 PM): My roommate is singing Beyonce BADLY
zanydoodles (10:13:39 PM): XD
zanydoodles (10:13:52 PM): where is Della's post? have you read my comment? WHY IS HE SINGING BEYONCE
renayorama (10:13:55 PM): Boys from North Carolina should NOT
zanydoodles (10:14:00 PM): last one first, please ;_;
renayorama (10:14:22 PM): He;s on the computer
renayorama (10:14:25 PM): I guess he likes her?
renayorama (10:14:32 PM): http://delladella.livejournal.com/18059.html?mode=reply
zanydoodles (10:14:46 PM): oh my LAWD, AH am from No'th Care-oh-layna
zanydoodles (10:14:55 PM): well, I lived there for five years, anyway
renayorama (10:15:08 PM): OH MY GOD
renayorama (10:15:11 PM): He just SCREECHED
renayorama (10:15:18 PM): I have to put on my headphones
renayorama (10:15:21 PM): I can't listen
zanydoodles (10:15:30 PM): oh dear
zanydoodles (10:15:32 PM): that soudns, um
zanydoodles (10:15:34 PM): oh dear
zanydoodles (10:15:43 PM): by the way, southern accents are hard to render phonetically ._.
renayorama (10:15:48 PM): Yeah
renayorama (10:15:56 PM): I do it with word choices, rather than accents
zanydoodles (10:16:16 PM): wise, in most typed of writing!
renayorama (10:16:39 PM): Someday soon I will have to write you a huge e-mail about my brain
renayorama (10:17:11 PM): And how it never shuts up
zanydoodles (10:17:52 PM): after my long kh email? ;_;
renayorama (10:17:54 PM): Yeah
renayorama (10:17:55 PM): ALSO
renayorama (10:17:58 PM): ONE PIECE.
zanydoodles (10:18:02 PM): I look forward to brain-email! I am into brains!
zanydoodles (10:18:05 PM): oh, right
zanydoodles (10:18:09 PM): One Piece XD
renayorama (10:18:12 PM): HAVE YOU CAUGHT UP
renayorama (10:19:38 PM): I squealed for oh, MAYBE an hour.
zanydoodles (10:19:50 PM): I've been skimming the Japanese and reading summaries, so I know what happens but have yet to read scanlations
renayorama (10:19:52 PM): Ah
renayorama (10:20:01 PM): WELL, I was lucky enough to get uh
zanydoodles (10:20:06 PM): what particularly pushed the squal button? or was it just the WHOLE THING
renayorama (10:20:10 PM): THE WHOLE THING
renayorama (10:20:18 PM): BUT MOSTLY FRANKY
zanydoodles (10:20:29 PM): oh lord XD
zanydoodles (10:20:32 PM): I LOVE THAT MAN
renayorama (10:20:48 PM): ME TOO
zanydoodles (10:21:08 PM): HE ALONE TRULY DESERVE ICEBURG'S MANLOVE
zanydoodles (10:21:15 PM): also, I heart Iceburg continuously >.>
zanydoodles (10:21:20 PM): OH MY FUCKING GOD THE BOAT
zanydoodles (10:21:28 PM): THE NEW SHIP OH MY GOD
renayorama (10:21:30 PM): I KNOW WHAT
renayorama (10:21:36 PM): HOLY CRAP
zanydoodles (10:21:47 PM): also, ROBIN. eating with them! and being all PART OF THEM FINALLY
renayorama (10:21:54 PM): ;___;
renayorama (10:22:01 PM): And being all "THIS IS MY PLACE!"
zanydoodles (10:23:01 PM): PS: Oda has given me the PREFECT OPPORTUNITY to try and go for those Iceburg/Robin and Franky/Robin though possibly not actually as pairing but still YAY. also, W7 is close to being done I can conitnue with my BIG FIC soon!
zanydoodles (10:23:04 PM): and SHANKS
zanydoodles (10:23:07 PM): also SHANKS
zanydoodles (10:23:10 PM): and a little more SHANKS
zanydoodles (10:23:15 PM): Paulie's new jacket:
zanydoodles (10:23:16 PM): gay?
zanydoodles (10:23:17 PM): or
zanydoodles (10:23:19 PM): GAY?
renayorama (10:23:22 PM): GAY
zanydoodles (10:23:29 PM): DEFINITELY GAY
zanydoodles (10:23:32 PM): CAN THE MAN BE ANY GAYER
renayorama (10:23:33 PM): NO
renayorama (10:23:37 PM): ALSO: SHANKS
renayorama (10:23:41 PM): I FANGIRL YOU
renayorama (10:23:46 PM): BUT WHY DID EVERYONE FALL DOWN
zanydoodles (10:23:59 PM): well, true, I thought he couldn't be gayer BEFORE and then he got THAT JACKET oh my GOD
renayorama (10:24:07 PM): He pretty gay
renayorama (10:24:10 PM): I love it. XD
zanydoodles (10:24:16 PM): INDEED
zanydoodles (10:24:49 PM): I love Sanji's bounty poster XDD
zanydoodles (10:24:52 PM): Nami's is SEXY.
renayorama (10:25:34 PM): OMG IS KNOW
zanydoodles (10:27:18 PM): Chopper's is RETARDEDLY ADORABLE.
zanydoodles (10:27:22 PM): even morese than Luffy's was.
zanydoodles (10:27:27 PM): THREATENING EVIL PIRATE.
renayorama (10:28:03 PM): XD
renayorama (10:28:15 PM): I want Usopp and Luffy to make up. ;______;
zanydoodles (10:28:26 PM): WE'RESTILL WAITING, ODA
zanydoodles (10:28:35 PM): I'm hoping it might have something to do with the new ship
zanydoodles (10:29:15 PM): god, I can't believe how long I've been following this manga in real-time
zanydoodles (10:29:39 PM): over a year now, in weekly doses.
renayorama (10:31:03 PM): XD
renayorama (10:31:07 PM): I am impressed
zanydoodles (10:32:18 PM): I am DEpressed XD
zanydoodles (10:32:26 PM): I will be OLD by the time this manga is over XD
zanydoodles (10:32:36 PM): but hey, I am guaranteed some form of entertainment for years to come!
renayorama (10:33:08 PM): Raven was like
renayorama (10:33:15 PM): "He's going to write this until he dies."
renayorama (10:33:20 PM): I said, "We're doomed."
renayorama (10:33:25 PM): He YOUNG
zanydoodles (10:34:19 PM): god, I KNOW
zanydoodles (10:34:27 PM): he makes me feel like I am wasting my youth XD
renayorama (10:36:33 PM): Me, too. >.>
zanydoodles (10:37:52 PM): well, confessions all around, then!
zanydoodles (10:38:05 PM): secretly, I think of Oda and try to drive myself harder.
renayorama (10:38:20 PM): Yeah
renayorama (10:38:33 PM): I've beend doing that lately with my novel
zanydoodles (10:38:47 PM): I love artists like that, who can inspire you to try to be MORE and not make you feel belittled... some artists/writers have that effect, weirdly, but not him. Bujold, too -- I read ehr afterwords and all I want to do is try harder to be up to par
zanydoodles (10:39:32 PM): oh hey. speaking of novels. I actually managed to squeak in my 50K for november but forgot to turn it in this week because of. um. this week ._.
zanydoodles (10:39:46 PM): oh well. I know I did it, who cares about the badge thingers. or whatever they give out.
renayorama (10:39:52 PM): ...wow
renayorama (10:39:54 PM): You did it?
zanydoodles (10:39:56 PM): I need to try to keep it up.
renayorama (10:40:05 PM): *impressed*
zanydoodles (10:40:12 PM): yeah. I am MEGA PROUD. and weirdly.. I feel... I dunno. normal?
zanydoodles (10:40:17 PM): like, this is how it should be.
zanydoodles (10:40:32 PM): I'm not even impressed, I'm like -- you should do this ALWAYS.
zanydoodles (10:40:38 PM): har!
renayorama (10:40:45 PM): I'd be impressed if I could do it everyday--TWICE
renayorama (10:40:53 PM): Like, so I write 3000 words a day
zanydoodles (10:41:05 PM): yes, I remember. that amazes me.
renayorama (10:41:13 PM): Maybe if I write 6000 I'll be impressed
zanydoodles (10:41:25 PM): oh! prolific people!
zanydoodles (10:41:33 PM): but hey, dude. THE PLOT TAKES SHAPE.
zanydoodles (10:41:40 PM): and I find myself OUT OF MY HISTORICAL DEPTH
renayorama (10:41:45 PM): I AM SO JEALOUS and totally fangirling. >.>
zanydoodles (10:41:51 PM): I need to find a friendly professor to consult on the idustrial revolutoon ;_;
zanydoodles (10:42:02 PM): revolution, even
zanydoodles (10:42:34 PM): I have the generalities worked out but I am feeling VERY PARANOID that my social and cultural and economic shifts wouldn't make sense historically
zanydoodles (10:42:37 PM): and I WANT them to
renayorama (10:42:44 PM): Hmm
renayorama (10:42:50 PM): Maybe some books?
renayorama (10:42:57 PM): I'm piling up the pirate books
zanydoodles (10:43:08 PM): I will starts with more books, but I would adore a real lvie person to bat history back and forth with
zanydoodles (10:43:20 PM): you need to find a Ph.D on PIRATES.
zanydoodles (10:43:25 PM): I"M SURE THEY'RE OUT THERE
zanydoodles (10:43:37 PM): people apparently have Ph.D.s in CARROT JUICE
zanydoodles (10:43:45 PM): someone MUST have a doctorate's in PIRATES
renayorama (10:44:05 PM): ...
renayorama (10:44:07 PM): carrot juice?
renayorama (10:44:23 PM): My pirates are really strange, I guess
zanydoodles (10:44:34 PM): industrial revolution is pretty easy... any professor of western history should be great. I am planning on hunting onw down. I can't write many more chapters without more history than I feel I posess ._.
renayorama (10:44:33 PM): An odd mixture of old and new
zanydoodles (10:44:40 PM): and yes, carrot juice.
renayorama (10:44:38 PM): So I dunno.
zanydoodles (10:45:22 PM): I, uh. just want to find a professor whom I could discuss the entire magic interaction thing with. explain my histories for all the cultures and ask if what I have set up makes ANY SENSE ;_;
zanydoodles (10:45:29 PM): I mean, writers do this, right?
renayorama (10:45:46 PM): Yeah, they try
renayorama (10:45:48 PM): LIKE ME.
zanydoodles (10:45:50 PM): perster innocent post-graduates who actually earn money with questions about books, right? ._.
renayorama (10:45:49 PM): I TRIED.
renayorama (10:46:04 PM): Dr. Key is an ASS.
zanydoodles (10:46:10 PM): oh no
zanydoodles (10:46:11 PM): who is this?
renayorama (10:46:13 PM): You could find a professor willing, I bet.  >D
zanydoodles (10:46:18 PM): is this the professor that was awesome at first?
renayorama (10:46:24 PM): He knows a lot about Indians
zanydoodles (10:46:31 PM): I don't do NAMES ;_;
renayorama (10:46:33 PM): Yeah
renayorama (10:46:37 PM): That's awesome guy
renayorama (10:46:40 PM): WHO IGNORED ME
zanydoodles (10:46:48 PM): meanie!
renayorama (10:46:47 PM): For four months. ;_;
zanydoodles (10:46:54 PM): whoa!
zanydoodles (10:46:56 PM): that's..
zanydoodles (10:46:58 PM): worse than ME!
renayorama (10:47:05 PM): Like, I told him how my novel opened and he sort of uh
renayorama (10:47:10 PM): STOPPED TALKING TO ME
zanydoodles (10:47:19 PM): how does it open?
zanydoodles (10:48:00 PM): OH MY GOD NAY I HAVE TO INTERRUPT
renayorama (10:48:01 PM): WHAT
zanydoodles (10:48:08 PM): REMEBER THAT TIMON/MUSHU PIC????
renayorama (10:48:09 PM): YES?
zanydoodles (10:48:12 PM): THERE IS A FOLLOW-UP COMIC
zanydoodles (10:48:16 PM): http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/4565789/
renayorama (10:50:22 PM): OH MY GOD
renayorama (10:50:23 PM): XD
zanydoodles (10:50:50 PM): sorry, that was essential information you needed RIGHT AWAY
zanydoodles (10:50:57 PM): (I swear THERE SHOULD BE FIC)
renayorama (10:51:10 PM): (THERE SHOULD)
zanydoodles (10:51:59 PM): anyway, um. continue about how your novel opens >.>
renayorama (10:53:29 PM): It rains diamonds
renayorama (10:54:00 PM): Okay, it rains like,  small diamonds and one BIG HUGE diamond.
renayorama (10:54:07 PM): Of doom
renayorama (10:54:28 PM): And when I say "rains" I mean, that they fall from the sky. *cough*
zanydoodles (10:54:58 PM): apparently this is cause to stop speaking to you for four months!
renayorama (10:55:07 PM): GUESS SO
renayorama (10:55:08 PM): ALAS.
zanydoodles (10:55:26 PM): I guess my time starts now
zanydoodles (10:55:26 PM): SNIFF
zanydoodles (10:55:26 PM): GOOD BYE NAY
zanydoodles (10:55:39 PM): seriously, what? I mean, we are trying to intrigue the audience into reading further, right? this is offensive?
renayorama (10:56:57 PM): I guess?
renayorama (10:57:04 PM): Maybe it was the waste of diamonds?
zanydoodles (10:58:42 PM): but... diamonds suck D=
zanydoodles (10:58:46 PM): in our world, at least.
zanydoodles (10:58:55 PM): I like their optical qualities
zanydoodles (10:59:07 PM): but their commodity status not so much
zanydoodles (10:59:21 PM): and I like their optics cause we STUDIED them in class. it was awesome.
zanydoodles (10:59:42 PM): I AM A DORK.
zanydoodles (10:59:54 PM): I WOULD RATHER SHINE LASERS THRIUGH DIAMONDS THAN WEAR THEM.
zanydoodles (11:00:08 PM): unless I can wear a ring turned wrong way out and slap someone who desrved it.
zanydoodles (11:00:18 PM): that is ONE possible use for diamond jewelry
zanydoodles (11:00:31 PM): so what about the BIG HUGE diamond of DOOM?
renayorama (11:00:51 PM): XD
renayorama (11:01:52 PM): I'm pretty sure the whole series is about gems
renayorama (11:02:45 PM): I always wonder how other writers work
renayorama (11:02:49 PM): I have VAGUE ideas.
zanydoodles (11:03:48 PM): My current published writer obsession is Bujold.
zanydoodles (11:04:21 PM): she seems to come up with characters first, then ask herself, "what is the worst thing that can happen to this character?" and then build a plot around that XD
zanydoodles (11:04:26 PM): MY KIND OF WOMAN.
renayorama (11:04:39 PM): ....WOW
renayorama (11:04:44 PM): I'm not that mean
renayorama (11:04:48 PM): Unless it's Weedyverse
zanydoodles (11:05:09 PM): XD
zanydoodles (11:05:21 PM): I adore her books. the funny thing is, they're not tragedies
zanydoodles (11:05:44 PM): they're just HEARTWRENCHING, in no small part because there is usually a happy ending of some sort.
ATTENTION (11:06:57 PM): prev_a.gif is not a valid image.
zanydoodles (11:07:26 PM): okay, whatever, AIM
zanydoodles (11:07:34 PM): don't midn that, just my computer spazzing -_-
renayorama (11:07:52 PM): >.>
zanydoodles (11:09:16 PM): it is old and tired -_-
renayorama (11:10:46 PM): Poor thing. :-(
zanydoodles (11:11:02 PM): I know. Travis will be here soon with less retarded computer!
zanydoodles (11:11:16 PM): and while he's here he can help me buy parts to make my own -_-
zanydoodles (11:11:29 PM): but hey, uh. it's 11! I meant to go to bed early today
zanydoodles (11:11:36 PM): so I think I'll trun in for tonight
zanydoodles (11:12:13 PM): thanks VERY much for the awesome comment. I hope it's okay my personal thanks section was short -- I hope I can trumpet your awesomeness to your fac enough to make up for it
renayorama (11:12:33 PM): XD
renayorama (11:12:38 PM): Hee hee, it was.
renayorama (11:12:52 PM): AND re: to my face
renayorama (11:12:56 PM): I WILL EXPLODE WITH GLEE.
zanydoodles (11:13:20 PM): face, yes. I can type.
zanydoodles (11:13:35 PM): anyway, sleep well, yeah? you need to tell me more about your book sometime, though
zanydoodles (11:13:38 PM): (also kh email XD)
renayorama (11:14:10 PM): I WILL
renayorama (11:14:11 PM): Hoyes
renayorama (11:14:14 PM): WORD VOMIT GALORE
zanydoodles (11:14:46 PM): EXCELLENT
zanydoodles (11:14:49 PM): good night!
renayorama (11:14:50 PM): Night! :-D
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renayorama (8:41:27 PM): Awaaaay for sleep
renayorama (8:41:29 PM): ?
zanydoodles (9:04:54 PM): you never answer my emails D=
renayorama (9:05:13 PM): No, I was sleeping all day
renayorama (9:05:18 PM): My sleeping schedule is backwards!
zanydoodles (9:06:21 PM): you still don't love me ;_______________;
zanydoodles (9:06:30 PM): you logged on an hour ago ;______________________________________________________;
zanydoodles (9:07:41 PM): well there wasn't actually much in the emails
zanydoodles (9:07:44 PM): I was just excited
renayorama (9:10:04 PM): Oh
renayorama (9:10:05 PM): Sorry
renayorama (9:10:10 PM): There's been meme drama
renayorama (9:10:13 PM): Someone left a bad comment
zanydoodles (9:11:23 PM): where?
zanydoodles (9:11:29 PM): not in the love/thanks meme?
renayorama (9:11:34 PM): Yes
zanydoodles (9:11:46 PM): that's..
zanydoodles (9:11:49 PM): beyond lame.
renayorama (9:11:59 PM): Yeah
renayorama (9:12:01 PM): Well
renayorama (9:12:04 PM): Kim asked for it
zanydoodles (9:12:28 PM): oh dear
renayorama (9:12:26 PM): Leave it to some jerk to see her comment out of the 50 others
zanydoodles (9:13:14 PM): oh dear. where is it?
renayorama (9:13:20 PM): I screened it
renayorama (9:13:32 PM): But Kim's comment is still there
renayorama (9:13:38 PM): In all it's "woe is me" glory
renayorama (9:19:00 PM): Anyway, sorry. That;s taken care of
renayorama (9:20:32 PM): D:
renayorama (9:20:37 PM): I wasn't ignoring you!
zanydoodles (9:20:48 PM): sorry, mother at the door
zanydoodles (9:20:57 PM): no, I mean
zanydoodles (9:21:02 PM): I'm totally the center of your universe
renayorama (9:21:22 PM): YOU ARE
zanydoodles (9:21:40 PM): OR ELSE >=O
renayorama (9:21:40 PM): Scarily enough. >.>
zanydoodles (9:22:06 PM): whoa, weird XD
zanydoodles (9:22:31 PM): well hey, uh. I really ddeep down don't actually *mind* respect and praise, but be careful I don't run you over by accident >.>
zanydoodles (9:22:35 PM): or on purpose! that's worse
renayorama (9:22:53 PM): XD
renayorama (9:22:59 PM): You're so funny!
zanydoodles (9:23:52 PM): so I'm told! I never understand, but I guess that's not required =P
renayorama (9:23:55 PM): SO
zanydoodles (9:23:59 PM): anyway, hey, FANDOM DRAMA ASIDE
zanydoodles (9:24:04 PM): progress on ffarchvie post!
renayorama (9:24:02 PM): NOW that I am done crying in the corner
renayorama (9:24:06 PM): LET'S TALK
renayorama (9:24:09 PM): YOU SAID THE MAGIC WORD
zanydoodles (9:24:23 PM): ffarchive? >.>
renayorama (9:25:20 PM): YES
zanydoodles (9:25:57 PM): excellent!
zanydoodles (9:26:16 PM): well, right now I had a couple of ideas I wanted to run by you
zanydoodles (9:26:19 PM): first of all
zanydoodles (9:26:42 PM): LORD ALMIGHTY, *WHY* do fan-related search engines not tolerate different name spelling, like Google does?
renayorama (9:26:53 PM): I...um
renayorama (9:26:55 PM): Dunno?
zanydoodles (9:27:03 PM): Google will forgive you plurals and infinitives and all that, but Aerith/Aeris is a SIN AGAINST FIC SEARCHES
zanydoodles (9:27:23 PM): I don't get it D=
zanydoodles (9:27:43 PM): so... would, say, having an option to "include name spelling variations" or something like that be a good idea?
renayorama (9:27:58 PM): Probably
zanydoodles (9:28:12 PM): some discreet little checkbox by the search entry field, like eBay's "search titles and descriptions" thing
zanydoodles (9:28:25 PM): it just seems very silly to me to have to search twice for the same thing, you know?
zanydoodles (9:28:38 PM): and I have yet to see anything of the sort implemented in any fic archive
zanydoodles (9:29:28 PM): of course, in some fandoms in might be a problem, but I don't think any of the FF fandoms have that idiosyncrasy?
renayorama (9:29:39 PM): FFVII is the only one I'm thinking of...
zanydoodles (9:30:41 PM): well, I mean where it could be an actual problem, like, um... different spelling denote, say... adhering to Japanese vs English canon or something? does FFVII have that?
renayorama (9:33:03 PM): Well, Aerith and Zax are the only ones that have the problem
renayorama (9:33:26 PM): And I remember the Raito/Light fandom wank other which name was "PROPER"
zanydoodles (9:33:56 PM): yeah, like I said, outher fandoms might have issues
renayorama (9:33:57 PM): So if you're asking whether or not we should include those names in searches when say, someone searches for "Aeris"
renayorama (9:34:02 PM): Then yeah
renayorama (9:34:08 PM): Because some people get really rabid over it
zanydoodles (9:34:53 PM): okay, yay. minor point, but I froth over it a little in other fandoms
zanydoodles (9:35:00 PM): the other things I was thinking about...
zanydoodles (9:35:41 PM): summaries are usually and rightfully limited to 256 characters. however, since most archvies don't have reliable categorizing/labelling/tagging systems, authors have to waste precious summary space enumerating pairings and characters and kinks and whatnot...
zanydoodles (9:35:47 PM): or at least, many authors seem compelled to.
renayorama (9:36:03 PM): Yeah.
zanydoodles (9:36:20 PM): this seems like... a waste of artistic space to me, I  guess. the summary is preciously short -- you should be able to use it as much as you can to entice people to read, right?
zanydoodles (9:36:34 PM): I think that might be another argument for a solid tagging system like at y!Gallery
zanydoodles (9:36:45 PM): have you read my emails, by the way? I ahd a question there about y!Gallery
renayorama (9:37:08 PM): Oh. I think it's fine to make an account like that?
renayorama (9:37:11 PM): I mean, really
renayorama (9:37:22 PM): They're free accounts, and we're technically browsing the archive
renayorama (9:37:23 PM): SO
zanydoodles (9:37:33 PM): an empty one, for ffarchive to use to prowl the tag system? I'll go ahead and set one up, then
renayorama (9:37:35 PM): I don't a tagging system like y!gallery
zanydoodles (9:37:38 PM): it's like homework.
renayorama (9:37:40 PM): *MIND
zanydoodles (9:37:43 PM): ASSIGNMENT #!: GO LOOKA T PORN
renayorama (9:37:52 PM): But y!gallery has these problems
renayorama (9:37:54 PM): It's ugly
renayorama (9:37:56 PM): It's slow
zanydoodles (9:37:59 PM): it is.
renayorama (9:38:02 PM): I really don;t like how the tags looks
renayorama (9:38:08 PM): But that's just me
zanydoodles (9:38:13 PM): no, they're pretty bad
renayorama (9:38:38 PM): It's like that put that together with the screen off
zanydoodles (9:38:43 PM): the loading time on the tag interface sucks, the whole site is... not awesomely aesthetic
zanydoodles (9:39:02 PM): If it makes you feel better, I can make a mockup for you of how it might look for us.
renayorama (9:39:04 PM): But the abuse of tags
renayorama (9:39:07 PM): That's what I worry about
zanydoodles (9:39:13 PM): yeah, a problem
zanydoodles (9:39:27 PM): a robust tagging system would perforce have to come with a robust modertion system.
zanydoodles (9:39:49 PM): and something like a fandom sponsor -- someone responsible for reviewing tags in each fandom to make sure the character lists are complete, make sense, etc
zanydoodles (9:40:07 PM): there were some fascinating ideas for a moderation system starting in one of the earlier discussions
renayorama (9:40:06 PM): I don't think I'd be comfy with letting members choose tags, really
renayorama (9:40:11 PM): BUT THAT'S JUST ME
renayorama (9:40:19 PM): Power in the hands of retards = bad
zanydoodles (9:40:25 PM): if somethign like that were in place, I'd feel pretty secure.
zanydoodles (9:40:37 PM): well, in the places I lurk, I have yet to see tag abuse at y!Gallery
zanydoodles (9:40:45 PM): people pretty much seem to be more or less honest about it.
renayorama (9:40:47 PM): Someone argued against tags
zanydoodles (9:40:54 PM): but then again, art is less ambiguous
renayorama (9:40:55 PM): I forget who
zanydoodles (9:41:04 PM): do you remember their argument?
renayorama (9:41:37 PM): Uh, no
renayorama (9:41:41 PM): darkrosetiger
renayorama (9:41:51 PM): She was the one who pushed for a robust search system
renayorama (9:42:12 PM): Wow, using y!gallery for an example will be hard when their server doesn't work
zanydoodles (9:43:48 PM): indeedy! I love using their tag system to find stuff, except WHEN I CAN'T
zanydoodles (9:44:06 PM): I'll need to look up darkrosetiger's idea...
renayorama (9:44:11 PM): Ours will be better because we'll have less fandoms, too.
renayorama (9:44:36 PM): It'll have to be structured different
zanydoodles (9:44:42 PM): oh yes, much easier
zanydoodles (9:44:56 PM): oh? I think so too, but tell me what your idea there is
renayorama (9:45:05 PM): I mean, that's art
renayorama (9:45:08 PM): We'll be writing
renayorama (9:45:27 PM): So the fact that their tag system is like, kind of intimidating is a drawback
renayorama (9:45:30 PM): Ours wouldn't be
renayorama (9:45:42 PM): But would be tag pairings?
renayorama (9:45:45 PM): *we
zanydoodles (9:47:26 PM): I was going to talk about pairings. they're a bit of a sticking point
renayorama (9:47:34 PM): Because some people do the whole dom/sub thing
zanydoodles (9:47:39 PM): here, you know what? while we talk, I will try to mock up an organization system
renayorama (9:47:40 PM): Dom character in front
renayorama (9:47:43 PM): WHICH I HATE
zanydoodles (9:47:50 PM): I have so little tolerance for the dom/sub things -_-
renayorama (9:47:56 PM): Because alphabetically is better
zanydoodles (9:48:21 PM): my view on this is that, if we tag pairings, we tag them in netural order -- alphabetically, no exceptions. If they INSIST on specifying dom/sub, they can do so in the summary.
zanydoodles (9:48:41 PM): however, my grudge is showing there. a lot.
zanydoodles (9:49:43 PM): see... the thing is, if we could build up an energetic community that polices itself, kind of, and is rewarded for doing so, then we COULD pull tricks like a tag system with fewer worries.
renayorama (9:49:57 PM): Yeah
zanydoodles (9:50:08 PM): oh, I dream a dream.
zanydoodles (9:50:31 PM): I found darkrosetiger's comment
zanydoodles (9:50:53 PM): not much argument, just a wish for a robust search engine
zanydoodles (9:50:59 PM): the thing is, that would still involve people tagging their own stories
zanydoodles (9:51:05 PM): unofficially, in summaries and stuff
zanydoodles (9:51:17 PM): but still users tagging/labelling their won stories.
zanydoodles (9:51:55 PM): backtracking a bit -- the scope of this part of the discussions includes three things, not two. they're just all very connecting.
zanydoodles (9:52:06 PM): ORGANIZING the archive, and browsing and searching it
zanydoodles (9:52:39 PM): we'll be an exclusively FF archive, and organizing just by game seems vastly inadquate
renayorama (9:52:51 PM): Oh?
zanydoodles (9:52:58 PM): that's part of why I'm grasping after finer organization schemes
renayorama (9:52:58 PM): Well, I assumed we'd have like
zanydoodles (9:53:07 PM): I think ficwad actually has characters and theme tags, too
renayorama (9:53:12 PM): Okay, the same reason I separate FFVII and like
renayorama (9:53:15 PM): AC
renayorama (9:53:18 PM): Spoilers.
renayorama (9:53:23 PM): People aren't interested.
zanydoodles (9:53:36 PM): eh?
renayorama (9:53:35 PM): But when you try that, people balk at you
renayorama (9:53:48 PM): I dunno. *headdesk*
zanydoodles (9:54:05 PM): well, it's different with an archvie than with a newsletter
renayorama (9:54:04 PM): I've had some people tell me in the archive, they want games split up
zanydoodles (9:54:15 PM): in the newsletter, you can only put the fic in one category
renayorama (9:54:24 PM): But it hurts my head.
zanydoodles (9:54:42 PM): whereas in the archvie, you can say "List all FFVII games, no matter which canon" and still have separate sections for each canon.
renayorama (9:54:58 PM): Yeah
zanydoodles (9:55:25 PM): so people who don't care about separating canons don't have to deal, and those who do, have their separate sections
zanydoodles (9:55:32 PM): but that's not the kind of thing I was talking about
zanydoodles (9:55:38 PM): although good point, thanks for bringing it up
renayorama (9:55:40 PM): Oh
renayorama (9:55:44 PM): I went off on a tangent
renayorama (9:55:46 PM): Sorry
zanydoodles (9:55:52 PM): no, it's okay!
zanydoodles (9:55:54 PM): tangents are good
zanydoodles (9:55:58 PM): they give more ideas
zanydoodles (9:56:08 PM): just as long as we return to the pain points sometime =)
renayorama (9:56:25 PM): XD
zanydoodles (9:57:00 PM): I'm trying to put together a mockup of how an organization system would look
zanydoodles (9:57:15 PM): my computer doesn't want to cooperate, but I'm *trying* ;_;
renayorama (9:57:24 PM): Come on computer!
renayorama (9:57:26 PM): You can do it!
zanydoodles (9:57:32 PM): well, back a second while I work on this
renayorama (9:57:37 PM): Okay
zanydoodles (9:57:45 PM): here is darkrosetiger's comment:
zanydoodles (9:57:57 PM): http://community.livejournal.com/ffarchive/1023.html?thread=5375#t5375
zanydoodles (9:58:19 PM): now, let's take her examle: noncon Seifer smut
zanydoodles (9:58:29 PM): and let's think about how a search engine would find that.
zanydoodles (9:58:43 PM): for one, I would be delighted if a search engine COULD find that, reliably.
zanydoodles (9:59:24 PM): do you understand what I meant about how the user is STILL tagging their own stories, even in this scenario? I wasn't very clear
renayorama (9:59:43 PM): Yeah
renayorama (9:59:45 PM): We make the tags
renayorama (9:59:47 PM): Right?
renayorama (9:59:50 PM): People choose them?
renayorama (9:59:53 PM): Or no?
zanydoodles (9:59:55 PM): no, no
zanydoodles (10:00:01 PM): let me explain, I was very unclear!
renayorama (10:00:04 PM): Maybe. >D
zanydoodles (10:00:28 PM): okay, let's assume we are a typical archvie like ff.net
zanydoodles (10:00:59 PM): where the only PRESPECIFIED things you have to choose from to tag your fic are category/canon and genre and rating
renayorama (10:01:11 PM): Okay
zanydoodles (10:01:25 PM): that means that at the very least, the "Seifer" and "noncon" parts will have to come from something the user put in by hand.
zanydoodles (10:01:43 PM): probably the smut part, too, since "R" and "NC-17" don't actually translate unilaterally to sex.
zanydoodles (10:02:10 PM): usually this happens because the author puts those three words in their summary.
zanydoodles (10:02:54 PM): let's assume we have made a very smart search engine and it will pull up that query even if instead of "noncon" the author used "nonconsentual" or "rape" and instead of "smut" used "porn" or any number of other things.
zanydoodles (10:03:24 PM): the author has STILL labelled their own story -- the only difference is they did it freehand. the disadvantage is that they probably used precious summary space to do so.
zanydoodles (10:03:42 PM): there are disadvantages to this system:
zanydoodles (10:03:50 PM): (let me list these, then respond?)
zanydoodles (10:03:59 PM): 1) author loses space in their summary
zanydoodles (10:04:14 PM): 2) you can ORGANIZE fics by any of those query points
zanydoodles (10:04:48 PM): 3) it's very difficult to make that smart a search engine, and no matter how much we try, we can't read minds. people will still probably need to try several different queries
zanydoodles (10:05:04 PM): those are the three primary difficulties I see.
renayorama (10:05:12 PM): Hmmm
zanydoodles (10:05:20 PM): let me present the other side
zanydoodles (10:05:27 PM): first, advantages of that sytem
zanydoodles (10:05:52 PM): 1) author is free to choose how they label their stories -- freehand = happy author, yes?
renayorama (10:06:06 PM): Yes
zanydoodles (10:06:37 PM): 2) no arguing with the archive about proper names for anything -- rape vs noncon
zanydoodles (10:07:33 PM): 3) less perceived obligation on the author's part to, say, spoil plot points by labelling deathfics. I feel like with a tagging system, authors will feel mroe pressure from that side of the warnings vs plot debate, and possibly readers will EXPECT more warning
zanydoodles (10:07:56 PM): so basically, the advantages I see are, this system gives the authors much mroe freedoma nd control and absolves the archive of a lot of responsibility
zanydoodles (10:08:18 PM): the downsides are, harder to find things and possibly a lot mroe work on out part put into search engines.
zanydoodles (10:08:31 PM): now I'll explain the tagging/categorizing side
zanydoodles (10:08:39 PM): let's assume we have a tag system that makes sense.
zanydoodles (10:09:15 PM): you can tag fics with which canon it belongs to, which characaters are in it, what genre it is, what kinks it contains, etc.
zanydoodles (10:09:41 PM): actually working out a sensible tag system is another matter entirely, but just like assuming we have made a smart search engine, let's pretend we have made a good tag/category system.
zanydoodles (10:09:59 PM): disadvantages:
zanydoodles (10:10:06 PM): 1) we'd have to maintain the tag system. bugger.
zanydoodles (10:10:13 PM): 2) we'd have to make sure it wasn't abused
zanydoodles (10:10:33 PM): 3) we would be held responsible for word choice, order choice, any nubmer of possible wank points
renayorama (10:10:55 PM): Oh well
zanydoodles (10:10:59 PM): 4) restricts or is PERCEIVED to restrict author creativity
renayorama (10:11:07 PM): OUR ARCHIVE.
zanydoodles (10:11:20 PM): (the last can be addressed with a responsible and quick system where extra tags can be suggested and added quickly)
zanydoodles (10:11:32 PM): advantages:
zanydoodles (10:12:08 PM): 1) much easier to find what you're looking for on the first try
zanydoodles (10:12:28 PM): 2) you can organize by this sytem -- I may have to explain this point
zanydoodles (10:13:17 PM): 3) frees up summary space
renayorama (10:13:39 PM): Well
renayorama (10:13:42 PM): I think I like it!
renayorama (10:13:48 PM): We do plan to have like
renayorama (10:13:50 PM): Fandom um
zanydoodles (10:13:54 PM): another thing about a tagging system is.. subtle, I guess. let me know when you have a moment, I'll explain one last advantage.
renayorama (10:13:54 PM): People in charge, right?
renayorama (10:13:58 PM): Of each section?
zanydoodles (10:14:01 PM): fandom sponsors?
renayorama (10:14:01 PM): Yeah
zanydoodles (10:14:05 PM): yes, I love that ideas.
renayorama (10:14:13 PM): Except each fandom should have more than one
zanydoodles (10:14:19 PM): yes.
zanydoodles (10:14:22 PM): please.
renayorama (10:14:25 PM): GODMODDING = NO
zanydoodles (10:14:33 PM): NO PLZ
zanydoodles (10:14:57 PM): okay, do you have a moment for one more advantage?
renayorama (10:14:58 PM): Yes!
zanydoodles (10:15:04 PM): well, more like a few minutes.
renayorama (10:15:02 PM): I HAVE LOTS OF MOMENTS
renayorama (10:15:12 PM): *has been waiting a long time!*
renayorama (10:15:14 PM): *SQUEE*
zanydoodles (10:15:34 PM): okay. we will head voer to eBay for a moment to spu on their category/search system, because I love how balanced it is.
zanydoodles (10:15:48 PM): I will find a suitable search that will demonstrate what I mean.
zanydoodles (10:17:19 PM): okay, here we go: search
zanydoodles (10:17:23 PM): er
zanydoodles (10:18:33 PM): http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dll?sofocus=bs&sbrftog=1&from=R10&submitsearch=Search&satitle=legend+of+zelda&sacat=-1%26catref%3DC6&sargn=-1%26saslc%3D2&sadis=200&fpos=22032&ftrt=1&ftrv=1&saprclo=&saprchi=&fsop=1%26fsoo%3D1&coaction=compare&copagenum=1&coentrypage=search&fgtp=
renayorama (10:17:25 PM): XD
zanydoodles (10:18:41 PM): if that urlfrightens you, just search eBay for "legend of zelda" without the quotes and without clicking any options
zanydoodles (10:19:02 PM): okay, let me know when you've pulled up the zelda search
renayorama (10:19:04 PM): Got it!
zanydoodles (10:19:13 PM): excellent
zanydoodles (10:19:30 PM): I picked Legend of Zelda because it fell under many catgories -- clothes, games, books, etc
zanydoodles (10:19:46 PM): now, eBay has a VERY robust categorizing system
zanydoodles (10:20:11 PM): aside: my personal differentiation between "categorizing" and "tagging" systems
zanydoodles (10:20:27 PM): categorizing systems are hierchichal, tagging systems aren't
zanydoodles (10:20:36 PM): so, eBay categorizes and y!Gallery tags. make sense?
zanydoodles (10:21:15 PM): (this is just a personal distinction,a nd I fuzz it plenty sometimes, but I thought it might be good to mention)
zanydoodles (10:21:45 PM): okay, so. back to our test gerbil: noncon Seifer smut.
zanydoodles (10:22:06 PM): although on second thought it might not be the best example here but I'll try to make it work
zanydoodles (10:22:51 PM): the point I am about to try to make is that a category/tag system, especially acting together with a good search engine, lets user PRIORITIZE each part of their search
zanydoodles (10:23:10 PM): for example, let's say I'm in the mood for some noncon. that will be my search word, like "legend of zelda was here"
renayorama (10:23:12 PM): Okay!
zanydoodles (10:23:23 PM): now I have found all the noncon/legend of zelda items
zanydoodles (10:23:41 PM): I can get more specific. I want... Seifer noncon fic / Zelda games
zanydoodles (10:23:57 PM): so, noncon/Zelda first, Seifer/game second. make sense?
renayorama (10:23:59 PM): Uh
renayorama (10:24:03 PM): No
zanydoodles (10:24:11 PM): I will try again!
renayorama (10:24:17 PM): Try not mixing games. >D
renayorama (10:24:26 PM): My brain I think is rebeling. >D
zanydoodles (10:24:44 PM): my first priority in the example was to find noncon fic. just like on ebay, my first priority was to find legend of zelda STUFF.
renayorama (10:25:01 PM): Okay
zanydoodles (10:25:16 PM): amke sense so far?
zanydoodles (10:25:25 PM): okay, good. lag kills, by the way.
renayorama (10:25:24 PM): Yes
zanydoodles (10:25:39 PM): after that, I can narrow my search and drop down to my second level of priorities.
zanydoodles (10:26:06 PM): having found all the noncon fics, I think for a moment and decide that out of all the noncon fics, I now want the Seifer ones.
zanydoodles (10:26:15 PM): in eBay, having found all the Zelda stuff, I now decide I would like a game instead of a shirt or book.
renayorama (10:26:29 PM): Oooo
renayorama (10:26:30 PM): Okay
zanydoodles (10:26:36 PM): it's like... it helps if you think of cravings.
zanydoodles (10:26:56 PM): I crave noncon. having assured myself of the existence of all the noncon, I can then narrow my search down to mroe specific things.
zanydoodles (10:27:49 PM): eBay will cleverly enough tell you how many things are in each category, if you sepcify far down enough
zanydoodles (10:28:03 PM): it should be showing numbers to you right now
zanydoodles (10:28:11 PM): so if I search ffarchive for noncon, I can, say...
renayorama (10:28:19 PM): Yeah
zanydoodles (10:28:45 PM): have catgories on the side with "FFVII" , "FFVIII", FFIX", and so on listing numbers of fics within, with possibly a couple of characters listed below, like eBay has
renayorama (10:28:51 PM): That would be sweet
zanydoodles (10:28:59 PM): as well as that, you can list ratings, say, or genres.
renayorama (10:29:00 PM): *cough* and better than ficwad
zanydoodles (10:29:05 PM): wouldn't that be nice?
zanydoodles (10:29:36 PM): so, yes. that's the last point I wanted to make about tags/categories
zanydoodles (10:29:43 PM): I found it hard to explain without an example
zanydoodles (10:29:47 PM): THANK YOU, EBAY.
renayorama (10:30:06 PM): YES.
renayorama (10:30:09 PM): EBAY. THANKS.
zanydoodles (10:30:27 PM): of course, for people who are impatient with tag/category systems, the search engine will still be there,a nd should be good enough to get what you want.
zanydoodles (10:30:48 PM): and I wish I wish I wish for a full-text search engine.
zanydoodles (10:30:55 PM): I really want to be able to search the body of fics.
zanydoodles (10:30:57 PM): PLEASE.
renayorama (10:30:58 PM): YES?
renayorama (10:31:06 PM): Well, I think that's an awesome thing
zanydoodles (10:31:17 PM): sometimes, all I will remember from a much-loved fic is some quote or bit or something and I WISH I could search for that
renayorama (10:31:30 PM): Then we should have it.
zanydoodles (10:31:33 PM): google will not always work there, sicne it can't access system-internal thigns D=
zanydoodles (10:31:37 PM): so!
renayorama (10:31:42 PM): Our search system is going to be like
renayorama (10:31:51 PM): Well, Rose wanted robust.
zanydoodles (10:31:56 PM): yes, this is why I want a robust tag and/or category system. your thought ont his, when you can?
zanydoodles (10:32:11 PM): oh yes. the best approach is make BOTH systems not only available, but GOOD.
zanydoodles (10:33:20 PM): the thing is, though, on most fic archives, the categories are so unhelpful or so shallow (example: ff.net -- very shallow) that I never browse, I always search
zanydoodles (10:33:27 PM): the only place I actually BROWSE is y!Gallery.
zanydoodles (10:33:36 PM): and that's annoying for all the reasons you already mentioned.
zanydoodles (10:34:03 PM): I brwosing system that WORKS would be ever so welcome in my world.
zanydoodles (10:34:59 PM): man, I am going to be making TONS of screencaps for this one to illustrate the kind of system I have in mind. -__
zanydoodles (10:35:23 PM): anyway, so. any thoughts on organizing/searching?
zanydoodles (10:36:17 PM): I do think that it should be self-evident that any system used to organize fics should also be able to be used to browse them. if that makes sense. they're... the same thing in my head, I guess? um. ask me if I was totally unclear just then ._.
renayorama (10:36:57 PM): No.
renayorama (10:37:00 PM): I think I get it
zanydoodles (10:37:05 PM): PS: is there any chance we can invovle delladella in the archive discussions? I don't know her, but she seems to have strong, rational opinions.
renayorama (10:37:09 PM): Do I really have anything to add? >D
renayorama (10:37:14 PM): I could invite her?
zanydoodles (10:37:23 PM): sure, that would be great
zanydoodles (10:37:32 PM): okay, well. DO you have anything to add so far?
zanydoodles (10:37:42 PM): I'm not done yet, this is just the major points I've got so far XD
renayorama (10:38:51 PM): You've uh.
renayorama (10:38:53 PM): Covered a lot
zanydoodles (10:38:56 PM): if you have nothing to add, then let me know any thoughts you have on what I've said so far? agreement, disagreement, asides, tangents?
renayorama (10:39:00 PM): I don't think about searching much
renayorama (10:39:03 PM): I GUESS I SHOULD
renayorama (10:39:13 PM): Mostly because most search systems annoy me
zanydoodles (10:39:19 PM): well, you asigned me the task of kicking off dicussions BECAUSE I cover a lot, right? XD
renayorama (10:39:24 PM): Will like,
renayorama (10:39:30 PM): Search operators be involved?
zanydoodles (10:39:45 PM): do you mean stuff like + - () ""?
renayorama (10:41:40 PM): Yeah
renayorama (10:41:53 PM): Although I only ever use + and ""
zanydoodles (10:42:27 PM): I like google's system of assuming "AND/+" between everything
zanydoodles (10:42:36 PM): since I think that's what most people MEAN when they type words together
zanydoodles (10:42:43 PM): and quotes yes, I definitely like quotes.
zanydoodles (10:43:03 PM): I think... I prefer google's take here over eBay's
zanydoodles (10:43:19 PM): last I checked, eBay used operators to construct advanced search strings
zanydoodles (10:43:44 PM): Google lets you mess around on your own with quotes and such, but for more advanced searches you go to ... um. the "Advanced Sarch" page
zanydoodles (10:44:22 PM): this might annoy the more boolean-enabled crowd, but I think that's a much smaller number of people than the ones that just want to type in their damn keywords and find the damn fic
renayorama (10:44:41 PM): I only ask because most people
zanydoodles (10:44:45 PM): I know how to contrcut boolean strings, but I really don't mind just suing the advanced search options instead, at least
renayorama (10:44:47 PM): Don't KNOW about operators
renayorama (10:44:58 PM): I only do because I took a course on library searches
zanydoodles (10:45:03 PM): yeah, uh. I'd rather not confuse the issue
zanydoodles (10:45:16 PM): I think the simple search that will be available on most pages should be just that
zanydoodles (10:45:17 PM): simple
renayorama (10:45:27 PM): Excellent!
zanydoodles (10:45:57 PM): I do think advanced search options should be AVAILABLE, though
zanydoodles (10:46:09 PM): on their own "advanced search" page, out of the way but readily accessible.
zanydoodles (10:46:33 PM): I will kill ff.net for having such a REATRDED set of search parameters.
zanydoodles (10:46:38 PM): retarded
zanydoodles (10:46:57 PM): okay, so... anything more to add about organizing and searching? because there's a whole other side to this issue
zanydoodles (10:47:07 PM): what to DISPLAY when fics have been browsed/searched for.
renayorama (10:47:20 PM): This is where I come in, with my SLACKING ON DESIGN SUGGESTIONS
renayorama (10:47:24 PM): I am sorry. >.>
zanydoodles (10:47:27 PM): (as in, title, summary, word count, rating, dates published/updated, and a host of other options_
zanydoodles (10:47:32 PM): oh this isn't design
renayorama (10:47:34 PM): Oh, yes it is
zanydoodles (10:47:42 PM): well, it is design, but it's not visual design.
renayorama (10:47:39 PM): *ARGUES*
renayorama (10:47:49 PM): Because most places
renayorama (10:47:52 PM): MAKE ME WANT TO VOMIT
renayorama (10:48:02 PM): I'd like to be able to read the results
zanydoodles (10:48:04 PM): visual design is how to organize and prettify all the things you choose to display
renayorama (10:48:12 PM): Now I get definitions
zanydoodles (10:48:16 PM): what I'm talking about is WHAT to display,. not HOW to display it
renayorama (10:48:14 PM): XD
renayorama (10:48:31 PM): I would think they'd relate
renayorama (10:48:33 PM): Okay, easy:
zanydoodles (10:48:37 PM): they do!
zanydoodles (10:48:41 PM): but you decide one before the other
renayorama (10:48:41 PM): If it makes it look cluttered
zanydoodles (10:48:45 PM): what comes before how.
renayorama (10:48:43 PM): I don't want it
renayorama (10:48:47 PM): Period.
renayorama (10:48:54 PM): So, less is more.
zanydoodles (10:48:56 PM): oh, with enough skill you can make anything look uncluttered.
renayorama (10:49:03 PM): ficwad is a good example
renayorama (10:49:10 PM): With all the stuff they pack in
renayorama (10:49:12 PM): NO.
zanydoodles (10:49:38 PM): I might not have that skill, but the priority is to decide what is important for users to be able to see about the fic right away. form is very important, but function is the priority in this particular discussion. for me, at least.
renayorama (10:49:37 PM): I maintain things are useless.
zanydoodles (10:49:46 PM): there will be a whole other discussion for form.
renayorama (10:50:14 PM): I don't know, I'm probably not the best one to ask.
renayorama (10:50:45 PM): Because when returning search reuslts I don't want to be slapped in the face with a bunch of useless crap
zanydoodles (10:50:56 PM): well, okay. let me ask you a simpler question. you are searching for fics and the archive has spat out a list for you. what things would you like the list of fics to include?
renayorama (10:50:53 PM): Which is normally what happens
zanydoodles (10:51:03 PM): title, summary, rating... what else?
renayorama (10:51:18 PM): word count, characters
renayorama (10:51:22 PM): That's it.
zanydoodles (10:51:25 PM): (and anything you specifically DON'T want to see right away?)
renayorama (10:52:22 PM): Let's see.
zanydoodles (10:52:51 PM): another way to ask is, what exactly do you consider "useless" in what you said a little earlier?
renayorama (10:53:32 PM): published dates, update dates, things like that
renayorama (10:53:43 PM): What I call useless statistics
zanydoodles (10:53:56 PM): number of views/reviews?
zanydoodles (10:54:00 PM): rating, if we have it?
zanydoodles (10:54:05 PM): um... complete/incomplete?
zanydoodles (10:54:14 PM): what else can I toss out here...
zanydoodles (10:54:15 PM): genre
renayorama (10:54:26 PM): I hope we limit the genre so that's not even an issue
zanydoodles (10:54:35 PM): type -- one-shot, multi-chaptered, etc
zanydoodles (10:54:42 PM): oh? limit the genre?
zanydoodles (10:55:00 PM): (by rating just now, I meant like stars out of five)
renayorama (10:55:38 PM): here's a good exampkle for ficwad
zanydoodles (10:56:03 PM): I might want an example; I haven't been there in a bit
renayorama (10:56:05 PM): A Shared Ancestor by BBC7Fan [Funny:1] Reviews - 0 Quistis ponders the family she never knows on the way to Esthar. 
Category: Final Fantasy 8 - Rating: (R) - Genres: Angst, Parody - Characters: General Caraway, Irvine, Kiros, Laguna, Quistis, Rinoa, Selphie, Squall, Zell - Warnings: [!!] [?] [V] - Chapters: 7 - Published: 04/01/06 - Updated: 04/01/06 - 1793 words - Completed: No
renayorama (10:56:15 PM): Like! Lord.
renayorama (10:56:33 PM): I mean, I get it's returning what the author provided
renayorama (10:57:05 PM): But I get kind of whelmed
zanydoodles (10:57:11 PM): yep, a bit much. I like having it all available, though, when I want it. I can gloss over it when I don't want it. but it's very annoying for some people, I know
renayorama (10:57:30 PM): And it might just be because it's all piled in
zanydoodles (10:57:38 PM): what did you mean by "limit the genre"?
renayorama (10:57:38 PM): If it was designed better
renayorama (10:57:46 PM): Someone people select every single freaking genre
renayorama (10:57:51 PM): And they all appear when you search
zanydoodles (10:57:57 PM): design can make a huge difference, yes. forget about design for now, focus on what INFORMATION you'd like to know.
renayorama (10:58:13 PM): I don't know
zanydoodles (10:58:19 PM): yeah, the hard part about genres is how subjective they are.
renayorama (10:58:20 PM): Like I said, I don't do searches
renayorama (10:58:35 PM): Because no search system works like I want it to
zanydoodles (10:58:46 PM): and characters, too. does thinking a lot about a character count, for example? things like that. ambiguous. useful, but ambiguous
renayorama (10:58:48 PM): Asking people who actually use searches might be better
zanydoodles (10:58:52 PM): how DO you find stories then?
renayorama (10:59:00 PM): I browse rec lists
zanydoodles (10:59:10 PM): well, the best I can do is suggest all my ideas and throw open the discussion
zanydoodles (10:59:17 PM): okay, how about a suggestion, maybe?
renayorama (10:59:36 PM): Suggestion?
zanydoodles (11:00:02 PM): yes, my compromise/hybrid
zanydoodles (11:00:06 PM): I am into compromises and hybrids, in case you haven't noticed XD
renayorama (11:00:06 PM): XD
renayorama (11:00:18 PM): It really also depends on how I'm searching
renayorama (11:00:25 PM): If I;m searching in the FFVIII category
zanydoodles (11:00:31 PM): have two options. one displays the bare essentials: title, author, summary, rating, word count (anything else?). THe other options displays EVERYTHING, like ficwad.
zanydoodles (11:00:36 PM): or, another idea
renayorama (11:00:36 PM): I don't need to be told the story is in that category
renayorama (11:00:51 PM): That's kind of what I mean by useless.
zanydoodles (11:02:53 PM): yeah, I understand that
renayorama (11:03:17 PM): Mostly, I read stories based on a few things
renayorama (11:03:25 PM): The summary.
zanydoodles (11:03:31 PM): okay, I'm going to ask you opinion of the two-option plan, and also I have one more idea, and then I have to run upstairs for a few minutes
renayorama (11:03:31 PM): The writing within the summary
zanydoodles (11:03:45 PM): (keep telling me what you're telling me now, I just have to go for a bit and want to get one more idea out)
renayorama (11:03:48 PM): Okay!
zanydoodles (11:04:49 PM): the other idea, besides the two options is to have a medium/minimal list of stuff to display on the search list, like the short list from earlier but with a couple more items like maybe characters. inside the fic, list EVERYTHING up at the top
zanydoodles (11:04:54 PM): I think ficwad might do this, lemme check
zanydoodles (11:07:58 PM): no, dammit, not the archive I was thinking of...
zanydoodles (11:08:02 PM): what WAS I thinking of... some archive did that
renayorama (11:09:43 PM): Hmm
zanydoodles (11:10:07 PM): okay, while I search for what the hell archive I meant, look at lunaescence:
zanydoodles (11:10:09 PM): http://www.lunaescence.com/fics/categories.php?catid=84
zanydoodles (11:10:35 PM): what do you think of how they display results? besides taking up a little too much space and also the title (THE LINK TO THE ACTUAL FIC) not being prominent enough
renayorama (11:10:42 PM): Uh
renayorama (11:10:53 PM): Disgusting.
renayorama (11:10:57 PM): Also, genre problem
renayorama (11:11:02 PM): But the tags are good.
zanydoodles (11:11:45 PM): explain how/why it's disgusting and explain the why/how the tags are good
renayorama (11:11:51 PM): All the things it lists shouldn't be more centered that the story link, author, and summary
renayorama (11:11:57 PM): It's a MESS
renayorama (11:12:03 PM): I don't even know what to look at
renayorama (11:12:40 PM): For instance, first one
renayorama (11:13:50 PM): the warnings I think are appropriate: spoilers, violence, death
zanydoodles (11:13:53 PM): and by "genre problem" (something you used/paraphrased/referred to several times now), do you mean authors getting overenthusiastic with tagging their story with everythigng ever?
renayorama (11:14:01 PM): Everything else: WHAT?
renayorama (11:14:04 PM): Yes
zanydoodles (11:14:13 PM): because it's not just genres -- it's characters, warnings, kinks, etc
renayorama (11:14:11 PM): Authors tagging their story with everything ever
renayorama (11:14:22 PM): I'm sorry, but stories normally fit into ONE genre
renayorama (11:14:29 PM): Maybe three at most, in my opinion
zanydoodles (11:14:42 PM): well, lunaescence has a HUGE problem with alignment and organization. what I DO like is that the summary is clearly separate and prominent.
renayorama (11:14:48 PM): Yeah, but it's at the bottom
zanydoodles (11:14:54 PM): three at the most, yes
renayorama (11:14:54 PM): Under loads of useless stuff
zanydoodles (11:15:03 PM): over would be better.
zanydoodles (11:15:15 PM): but I like that it's separate. the general organization is very messy, though
renayorama (11:15:33 PM): And "story types" is vague
renayorama (11:15:37 PM): "open" is vague
renayorama (11:16:03 PM): I like the "main characters" distinction
zanydoodles (11:16:34 PM): those I don't get either
zanydoodles (11:16:41 PM): ooh
zanydoodles (11:16:46 PM): "main" is a good keyword XD
renayorama (11:17:16 PM): I like how they're set apart in the little tables? divs?
renayorama (11:17:19 PM): Whatever they ight be
zanydoodles (11:17:31 PM): I think limiting genres is a very good idea. that and characters are the two categories that get overinflated the most.
zanydoodles (11:18:29 PM): you mean how each... entry/story is a separate little box?
zanydoodles (11:18:41 PM): I really like that, actually. it makes each stoy feel special =D
zanydoodles (11:19:23 PM): should there be limits on any other chategories? characters? warnings? kinks/themes/whatever?
zanydoodles (11:19:58 PM): for what I mean by themes, um... y!Gallery has a similar category, I think, where they list everything from specific kinks to general themes like "platonic friendship"
zanydoodles (11:20:27 PM): I don't use it much, I must admit, but I'm sure people who HAVE kinks might. um. can't speak for them.
zanydoodles (11:20:48 PM): characters... if there's a limit, it should be generous =\
zanydoodles (11:21:26 PM): warnings I'm not sure about. for one, I think there's a small number of things that GO there specifically, and I don't want to limit peoples' ability to warn readers, you know?
zanydoodles (11:21:58 PM): spoilers, violence, death. rape/noncon, maybe. incest?
zanydoodles (11:22:08 PM): oh, and we have yet to dicuss pairings -_-
zanydoodles (11:22:16 PM): (by the way, I don't have to go upstairs anymore)
renayorama (11:24:41 PM): LAG, whoa
renayorama (11:24:45 PM): Cacthing up
renayorama (11:25:23 PM): Okay
renayorama (11:25:57 PM): When we do beta testing, I think it's totally plausible for us to come up with a pretty thorough systems to warnings for people to use
renayorama (11:26:19 PM): So people won't have to be all "suggest suggest"
zanydoodles (11:26:30 PM): yeah
zanydoodles (11:26:41 PM): oh, beta testing! I look forward to you, and yet I dread you so!
renayorama (11:26:46 PM): Was that serious an OOC warning tag?
renayorama (11:26:48 PM): Because uh
zanydoodles (11:27:03 PM): what? ooc tag? where???
zanydoodles (11:27:10 PM): I wouldn't stand for that
zanydoodles (11:27:22 PM): I am NOT wasting archvie resources hosting such a tag
zanydoodles (11:27:34 PM): if authors insist on "warning" for OOC, they can waste summary space on it.
zanydoodles (11:27:37 PM): sorry, no mercy.
renayorama (11:28:31 PM): Oh, excellent
renayorama (11:28:49 PM): Yeah, at that archive you showed me
zanydoodles (11:29:00 PM): nor anything like "Product of High Sugar Intake"
renayorama (11:29:00 PM): One of the warnings was "OOC"
zanydoodles (11:29:14 PM): yeah, I saw
zanydoodles (11:29:23 PM): the one at the very top ahs an impressive list of warnings.
zanydoodles (11:29:29 PM): good model for what NOT to make a warning system.
zanydoodles (11:29:31 PM): although!
renayorama (11:29:29 PM): Yeah
zanydoodles (11:29:47 PM): two things that ARE interesting
zanydoodles (11:30:13 PM): there are "Adult Situations" and "Mild Adult Situations" which is, um, a little silly I think, but it puts me in mind of ficwad where it warns for... I think three things? violence, sex, and spoilers
zanydoodles (11:30:24 PM): and it asks you to rate each on mild/medium/heavy
zanydoodles (11:30:27 PM): that I like!
zanydoodles (11:30:41 PM): that's what those X's and exclamation points in brackets are.
renayorama (11:30:43 PM): Yeah
renayorama (11:30:48 PM): Unles you don't know what they mean
zanydoodles (11:30:57 PM): yeah, that's, uh
zanydoodles (11:30:58 PM): not good
zanydoodles (11:31:03 PM): that's the part that's retarded.
zanydoodles (11:31:29 PM): but I like the idea of having a LIMITED number of warnings and then being able to rate them at least mild/heavy
zanydoodles (11:31:42 PM): how to display that is a different question.
zanydoodles (11:32:04 PM): like I said, we're all about structure and information here, not how it will end up looking
zanydoodles (11:32:47 PM): I want to have what we WANT and then ifing on visualy HAVE to pare down from that depending on visual design constraints. I'd rather start with a long list that I can make shorter than truncate the list to start with and possibly miss out on good ideas
renayorama (11:33:10 PM): Well, it depends.
renayorama (11:33:18 PM): A good question to ask, I think
zanydoodles (11:33:21 PM): err, a word in the first sentence made no sense. but I think you got the gist of it.
renayorama (11:33:24 PM): Everyone wants something different
zanydoodles (11:33:32 PM): yep
zanydoodles (11:35:04 PM): I'm still of the philosophy that you should aim higher and give ground when necessary, rather than limiting yourself from the start and missing opprotunitues. at least at this stage.
renayorama (11:36:30 PM): How far are you on the post itself? >.>
zanydoodles (11:37:42 PM): I've done the "needs/wants" section, and some of the synthesis
zanydoodles (11:37:55 PM): I still need to make the examples section coherent and do screencaps
renayorama (11:38:26 PM): Do we get to whore out your logo ever?
renayorama (11:38:27 PM): >.>
renayorama (11:38:33 PM): Because I sort of want to fangirl it a alot
zanydoodles (11:39:57 PM): and a lot of synthesis left to do -- I wanted to talk to you first about a lot of that
zanydoodles (11:41:46 PM): sorry, the lag is atrocious
renayorama (11:41:59 PM): Wow
renayorama (11:42:53 PM): It's okay! I am patient
renayorama (11:43:03 PM): What part of the synthesis?
zanydoodles (11:43:26 PM): and yes, I will refine the logo design soon
zanydoodles (11:43:30 PM): Travis is arriving with his nonretarded computer soon,a dnt hen I can SCAN THINGS again
renayorama (11:43:59 PM): Yay, scanning! :-D
zanydoodles (11:45:23 PM): I'll scan my sketches of it
zanydoodles (11:45:26 PM): the photoshopped version was pretty sad XD
zanydoodles (11:46:10 PM): hmm, well. the last thing I was wondering about was pairins.
zanydoodles (11:46:14 PM): any thoughts? I had an idea, but I'm not sure I still like it
renayorama (11:47:11 PM): Well, hit me with your idea.
zanydoodles (11:48:48 PM): well, I don't know. it assumed we'd WANT to tag for pairings. do we?
renayorama (11:48:52 PM): Yes
renayorama (11:49:01 PM): But we have to think of multipes
renayorama (11:49:03 PM): Threesomes
renayorama (11:49:15 PM): I think I'm drawing the line at FOURSOMES though
renayorama (11:49:25 PM): I mean, really.
zanydoodles (11:50:43 PM): XD
renayorama (11:50:58 PM): I think that's fair,right?
renayorama (11:51:08 PM): Characters, pairings, threesomes?
zanydoodles (11:51:15 PM): Probably. Nakamship come to mind, though XD
zanydoodles (11:51:27 PM): nakamaship
renayorama (11:51:33 PM): I don't think any FF has that, exactly. >D
zanydoodles (11:51:41 PM): and, uh, I don't know. Turk-cest? Guardian-cest?
renayorama (11:51:43 PM): But then we would at least have one WORD fir it
zanydoodles (11:51:54 PM): whatever, people will come up with anything.
renayorama (11:52:07 PM): Instead of Sephiroth/Cloud/Zack/Aeris OT4
zanydoodles (11:52:29 PM): what would that be called? ;_;
renayorama (11:52:40 PM): I don't know
zanydoodles (11:52:44 PM): because then there would have to be NAMES of some kind and names are... iffy =|
renayorama (11:52:49 PM): Yeah
renayorama (11:53:06 PM): But when we have pairings, it's going to come up. Guess we can deal with it in discussion
zanydoodles (11:53:21 PM): well, okay. um. I had an idea. it might be crazy/retarded.
zanydoodles (11:53:38 PM): it would certainly be interesting to code. just the kind of weird things I would perversely enjoy.
renayorama (11:53:47 PM): >.>
zanydoodles (11:53:56 PM): to take care of all those sad, neglected obscure pairings and threesomes and whatever.
zanydoodles (11:54:42 PM): a kind of... pairing generator. where you have lists of all the characters and you pick however many and the generator slaps them together for you in alphabetical order, thankyouverymuch, and that's your tag.
renayorama (11:55:04 PM): Huh
zanydoodles (11:55:19 PM): so that new pairings/threesomes/whatnot can be created on the spot, legitimately, from pre-prepared lists (moderated by the fandom sponsors)
zanydoodles (11:55:36 PM): there might be a list of popular/existing tags to choose from, maybe?
renayorama (11:55:58 PM): Moderation is important, I think
zanydoodles (11:57:29 PM): if, say... mroe than, um. 10? stories have a tag, it gets a slot in the list, but everything else has to be created by the author from the lists of characetrs.
renayorama (11:57:59 PM): Yeah, possibly.
zanydoodles (11:58:22 PM): that way., no complaints about rare pairings not getting their share or taking too long to be added.
zanydoodles (11:58:34 PM): if you write the pairings and tag it, then it's in the database.
renayorama (11:59:12 PM): Yeah
zanydoodles (11:59:18 PM): assuming the tagging and browsing systems are related, then that would also entail that the pairings now has its own category, and anything else that might follow
zanydoodles (12:00:42 AM): I like this idea because it standardizes everything -- spelling, order, no name mashes or strange ship names -- but is still fair to rarer ships
zanydoodles (12:01:03 AM): but like I said, interesting to code.
zanydoodles (12:01:05 AM): any drawbacks?
renayorama (12:01:23 AM): Well, what happens if it's done incorrectly?
zanydoodles (12:01:39 AM): cross-fandom pairings might get interesting, though considering the limited number of fandoms, it wouldn't be unmanagable.
zanydoodles (12:01:46 AM): well, incorrectly how?
renayorama (12:01:53 AM): Would it be possible?
zanydoodles (12:01:57 AM): do you mean, labelling a fic with a paring that is not actually in the fic?
renayorama (12:01:58 AM): Yeah
renayorama (12:02:03 AM): Abusing it, basically
zanydoodles (12:02:21 AM): that falls under the same category as labelling a fic with characters that aren't in it. it's subjective, difficult, and messy.
zanydoodles (12:02:31 AM): it's the same problem a tagging system has in general.
zanydoodles (12:02:38 AM): not just this part I jut mentioned.
zanydoodles (12:03:13 AM): the only way to counteract it is to foster a community that encourages correct use and discourages or outright punishes abuse
zanydoodles (12:03:29 AM): the tricky part is that it's subjective -_-
renayorama (12:03:56 AM): Kind of what I want the sponsers for
renayorama (12:04:05 AM): To be able to see when new combinations are created
zanydoodles (12:04:24 AM): there are cases where it would be clear, of course, like say... um... someone labelling their story with a popular ship when that ship, even those characters, are nowehrre in it, just for publicity. that should be punished.
zanydoodles (12:04:55 AM): but we can't have people getting their wrists slapped if their Auron/Braska fic is labelled as such but most people think it's just platonic/frienship or whatever
zanydoodles (12:05:03 AM): and yes, fandom sponsors would need to oversee a lot of this -_-
zanydoodles (12:05:57 AM): I like the modding idea discussed before... unmoderated submissions, but members being able to freely flag fics for violations and those being brought quickly to modly attention for actual reading, decisions..
zanydoodles (12:06:21 AM): I think that there should be options for reporting tag abuse, where each tag is listed and you can say "no, that doesn't belong here"
renayorama (12:06:44 AM): Yeah. Well, hopefully we can find the fandom sponsers for it. >D
zanydoodles (12:07:00 AM): each inappropriate tag = one flag
zanydoodles (12:07:00 AM): or something
zanydoodles (12:07:05 AM): (slaps on the wrist for abusing the abuse report system, of course)
renayorama (12:07:19 AM): Yeah
renayorama (12:07:42 AM): Largely self-policing, would be good.
zanydoodles (12:09:30 AM): anyway, yeah. it would be a hell of a mod job, but would it make for good searching/browsing/categorizing and generally amking readers'authors' lives easier?
renayorama (12:09:39 AM): It sounds like it
renayorama (12:13:58 AM): And we thought the rating system was going to be hard? HO HO HO.
zanydoodles (12:14:19 AM): well, I'll pitch that idea in the post, too
renayorama (12:14:33 AM): Hmm?
renayorama (12:14:41 AM): I mean, like, the last post
zanydoodles (12:14:45 AM): the pairings idea
zanydoodles (12:14:51 AM): pitch that, I mean. the generator
renayorama (12:14:53 AM): OH, okay
renayorama (12:15:13 AM): I think the generator would be good re: no dom/sub crap
renayorama (12:17:03 AM): I am big on organization and having like
renayorama (12:17:18 AM): Seifer/Squall AND Squall/Seifer categories drives me BATTY
renayorama (12:17:28 AM): Well, the thought ofit
zanydoodles (12:19:54 AM): yes.
zanydoodles (12:20:00 AM): batty is a good word for it
zanydoodles (12:20:01 AM): I can't get angry because it just so BOGGLINGLY STUPID.
zanydoodles (12:20:48 AM): and there's TWO sides to the stupidity, even. the very idea of people squabbling over dom/sub, and then the archive or whatever wasting resources hosting both -_-
zanydoodles (12:21:01 AM): and now, a newsletter question!
renayorama (12:21:21 AM): OH
renayorama (12:21:25 AM): Okay?
renayorama (12:23:19 AM): >.>
renayorama (12:24:21 AM): Your computer hates me! *weeps*
zanydoodles (12:25:05 AM): yes it does -_-
zanydoodles (12:26:34 AM): read the comment at the bottom, please? http://community.livejournal.com/grand_line_vine/31958.html
renayorama (12:27:07 AM): Um
renayorama (12:27:15 AM): Okay, number one
renayorama (12:27:17 AM): WAY RUDE
renayorama (12:28:12 AM): Number two, their being unable to signup is something they should take up with the owners of the site
renayorama (12:28:14 AM): FOR REAL
renayorama (12:28:43 AM): Do you want to put a warning by these links?
zanydoodles (12:29:07 AM): I think we had a similar situation (maybe even the same person, I really don't remember) waaaay back at the beggining of the newsletter where they couldn't access ygallery. the problem MIGHT be that they're using internet explorer. in any case, I try to label for members-only stuff, but I don't label by archive, and it's just a ygallery thing, that I think they don't work on ie? I don't remember -_-
zanydoodles (12:29:08 AM): anyway, I'm a little annoyed at the tone, but I want to help.
zanydoodles (12:29:30 AM): it might actually be my fault -- I may have failed to tag them as members-only. I can't tell if that's the problem, or her browser
zanydoodles (12:29:54 AM): I... don't really want to label for specific archives >.>
renayorama (12:30:17 AM): Yeah
renayorama (12:30:21 AM): That's a lot of freaking work
zanydoodles (12:30:31 AM): If I could, I'd but a big ugly FF.NET >=O all over the fic section XD
zanydoodles (12:31:15 AM): I think... how does this sound?
zanydoodles (12:31:50 AM): I'll explain that it could be her browser or it could be my fault, in which case I apologize and will try to be more vigilant. however, registering with the site is something she should take up with the site admins, I can't help there.
renayorama (12:32:14 AM): That sounds good.
zanydoodles (12:32:17 AM): (my fault in that I didn't tag them as member-locked, if they are -- I'd need to check for this set but if she's had the problem in the past I can't know which it is)
zanydoodles (12:32:29 AM): okay, I'll go with that
zanydoodles (12:32:38 AM): still, is it just me or was that kind of, um
zanydoodles (12:32:49 AM): not very polite?
renayorama (12:32:48 AM): No
renayorama (12:32:50 AM): It was rude
renayorama (12:32:53 AM): Straight up
renayorama (12:32:56 AM): Period
zanydoodles (12:34:07 AM): well, I'm glad it wasn't just me, I guess. thought it would have been nice if she weren't being rude in the first place
zanydoodles (12:34:08 AM): anyway, okay. thank you VERY much for the help with my archive post!
zanydoodles (12:34:36 AM): I will still need to propose an actual organization scheme, but I'm glad to have discussed all those things with you
zanydoodles (12:34:45 AM): was there anything else you wanted to add/ask/point out?
renayorama (12:35:17 AM): Hmmm
zanydoodles (12:35:27 AM): I will try to distill the essence of tonight's discussions into what should be a good part of the synthesis section, and then I'll just have examples and a lot of wrapping up to do.
renayorama (12:35:52 AM): Wow
renayorama (12:35:54 AM): That was uh
renayorama (12:35:57 AM): Fast?
renayorama (12:36:00 AM): I mean, compared to the first
zanydoodles (12:36:17 AM): well, this one's been dribbling out for what, almost two months?
zanydoodles (12:36:34 AM): there will be a lot of editing to do, of course, but I do hope I can finish the first draft soon
renayorama (12:37:19 AM): I need to like, get Zach WORKING on things again
zanydoodles (12:37:41 AM): let's see... after this one will be... user area, I think?
renayorama (12:38:01 AM): Yeah
renayorama (12:38:04 AM): That's on your list
renayorama (12:38:47 AM): I've been actyally
renayorama (12:38:52 AM): Collecting stuff for that?
renayorama (12:39:03 AM): Thoughts, screencaps, etc.
zanydoodles (12:39:12 AM): yep, user panel and author area
zanydoodles (12:39:14 AM): lots of screenaps for that one, as it's all members-only
renayorama (12:39:26 AM): That's where we talk about
renayorama (12:39:28 AM): DUN DUN DUN
renayorama (12:39:33 AM): Document Manager
renayorama (12:39:36 AM): *snicker*
zanydoodles (12:39:44 AM): yes, I have a lot to say about it. most user panels annoy the hell out of me.
zanydoodles (12:39:52 AM): OH GOD NO
zanydoodles (12:39:54 AM): NO DOCUMENT MANAGER EVER
renayorama (12:39:53 AM): XD
renayorama (12:39:58 AM): NO, THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING
zanydoodles (12:40:06 AM): yes, I know
renayorama (12:40:06 AM): Hee
zanydoodles (12:40:11 AM): BUT THE VERY THOUGHT ._.
renayorama (12:40:12 AM): I know. D:
zanydoodles (12:40:31 AM): if it weren't for the document manager, ff.net with all its other problems would be tolerable
zanydoodles (12:40:32 AM): BUT NO
zanydoodles (12:40:43 AM): document manager bumped it over the line into hatred.
renayorama (12:40:54 AM): Hopefully the things I collected will help?
zanydoodles (12:40:58 AM): that and its obsessive loathing of punctuation.
zanydoodles (12:41:04 AM): that's also special
zanydoodles (12:41:08 AM): ooh, things you collected?
renayorama (12:41:06 AM): I dunno, you have a lot of the same accounts as me?
renayorama (12:41:12 AM): Yeah, like sites I'm a member of
zanydoodles (12:41:22 AM): heads up, layout/design post is right after the user panel one. you better have stuff for me! XD
renayorama (12:41:22 AM): I took screenshots and made some notes, way back in August
renayorama (12:41:24 AM): XD
zanydoodles (12:41:29 AM): ooh, excellent
zanydoodles (12:41:31 AM): I want thos
zanydoodles (12:41:32 AM): e
renayorama (12:41:36 AM): I'll upload them somewhere
zanydoodles (12:41:42 AM): I think you showed me those at one point, even?
renayorama (12:41:46 AM): Hmm
renayorama (12:41:50 AM): No, I showed design
renayorama (12:41:55 AM): Which is still in the same place
zanydoodles (12:42:05 AM): I remember some kind of disucssion of ffnet's user panel, at least. maybe I'm thinking of the design things
renayorama (12:42:06 AM): Yeah
zanydoodles (12:42:29 AM): can we please NOT have an obsessive hatred of puctuation? D=
renayorama (12:42:35 AM): YES, PLZ.
renayorama (12:42:45 AM): Punctuation isn't bad!
zanydoodles (12:42:49 AM): I swear, punctuation is not the devil!
renayorama (12:42:55 AM): Gratuitous asterisks might be
zanydoodles (12:43:02 AM): yes.
zanydoodles (12:43:09 AM): but ffnet takes it way too far
renayorama (12:43:18 AM): Isn't the document manager like
renayorama (12:43:29 AM): Was it created out of a hate-on for punctuation?
zanydoodles (12:43:40 AM): I think it might have been ._.
renayorama (12:43:48 AM): I can't upload anything anymore
renayorama (12:43:56 AM): If it's longer than 3000 words, it cuts me off
zanydoodles (12:44:02 AM): in which case the document manager and the punctuation hate are the same thing and I still hate ff.net for it
renayorama (12:44:08 AM): I have to like
renayorama (12:44:11 AM): PASTE things in
renayorama (12:44:12 AM): NOT GOOD
zanydoodles (12:44:19 AM): ._.
zanydoodles (12:44:34 AM): I want to see user panel comments!
zanydoodles (12:44:38 AM): upload plz? =D
renayorama (12:44:46 AM): Oh!
renayorama (12:44:53 AM): They're all on my desktop!
renayorama (12:44:58 AM): I wasn't prepared!
renayorama (12:45:09 AM): OH, one thing
renayorama (12:45:14 AM): We talked about it before?
renayorama (12:45:20 AM): Notifications
zanydoodles (12:45:33 AM): yes?
renayorama (12:45:43 AM): Like DevArt does it?
zanydoodles (12:45:52 AM): of um... reviews, updates, etc?
zanydoodles (12:45:53 AM): that stuff?
renayorama (12:45:54 AM): I talk about that
renayorama (12:45:55 AM): Yeah
zanydoodles (12:46:03 AM): ooh, yes
zanydoodles (12:46:03 AM): I like those, actually
renayorama (12:46:08 AM): My only concern was like
renayorama (12:46:19 AM): People abandoning their accounts and the notifications piling up
zanydoodles (12:46:22 AM): I wish reviews were emailed, though. that's such a nice feeling =D
zanydoodles (12:46:49 AM): yeah, abandoned accounts! that will ahve to be dealt with in many areas =\
renayorama (12:47:03 AM): Hardcore. :/
zanydoodles (12:47:24 AM): yes. that will go in the post after layout, the general archive management/moding post, I think
zanydoodles (12:48:22 AM): well, email me or something when you can upload them?
renayorama (12:49:06 AM): Yes!
zanydoodles (12:49:51 AM): or wait, is the desktop till out of commission? D=
renayorama (12:50:05 AM): No
renayorama (12:50:08 AM): Zach's just on it
zanydoodles (12:50:12 AM): oh good!
zanydoodles (12:50:19 AM): well, okay, let me know!
zanydoodles (12:50:32 AM): so you owe me... kh email, brain email, and userpanel email!
zanydoodles (12:51:04 AM): oh, also other news -- I said yes to affiliating with kh_press, in the interest of wank avoidance. oh, wank avoidance! how IS kh_press doing these days, by the way?
zanydoodles (12:51:12 AM): did anyone take up the offer to take it over?
renayorama (12:54:06 AM): It wasn't an offer
renayorama (12:54:13 AM): It was on her journal, locked
zanydoodles (12:56:00 AM): ah. well, I don't rememer the details.
zanydoodles (12:56:13 AM): how is it doing, though? is, um.. Amanda? Is that the right name? ._.
renayorama (12:56:14 AM): Yeah
renayorama (12:56:16 AM): I dont read it
renayorama (12:56:19 AM): I assume okay?
zanydoodles (12:56:41 AM): is she feeling all right with it again?
renayorama (12:56:58 AM): She hasn't talked about it again, so I suppose
renayorama (12:57:06 AM): And I can't say I read her journal, much
renayorama (12:57:17 AM): Because she doesn't do much but uh
renayorama (12:57:18 AM): COMPLAIN?
zanydoodles (12:58:53 AM): oh. well.
renayorama (12:58:56 AM): >.>
zanydoodles (12:59:05 AM): I prefer having a real-live captive audience when I complain XD
renayorama (12:59:08 AM): Hee
renayorama (12:59:13 AM): Well, it's just dumb stuff
renayorama (12:59:20 AM): She complains about school CONSTANTLY
renayorama (12:59:30 AM): I'm like "OH MY GOD, IF YOU HATE IT, DROP OUT."
renayorama (12:59:34 AM): I mean, I did!
renayorama (12:59:50 AM): >.>
renayorama (12:59:53 AM): Not that I uh
renayorama (12:59:58 AM): Encourage people to do that
zanydoodles (1:00:30 AM): you just can't be sure your whining got their full attention on lj, you know?
zanydoodles (1:00:31 AM): school? oh, lame and trite XD
zanydoodles (1:00:33 AM): sorry. but constant school complaints are, um. pretty dull lj-dfodder =\
renayorama (1:00:38 AM): Just a little.
renayorama (1:01:01 AM): And my complaints were more like "Hmm, I want to drop out of school and write a novel!"
renayorama (1:01:09 AM): Rather than complaining about school. :-(
renayorama (1:01:35 AM): How's that working for me. HMM.
zanydoodles (1:01:43 AM): I found school singularly uninteresting to complain about XD
zanydoodles (1:01:56 AM): how IS that working for you? the dropping out and writing?
zanydoodles (1:02:05 AM): you seem to be havig fun keeping your own hours XD
renayorama (1:02:21 AM): I'm happier.
zanydoodles (1:02:46 AM): (speaking of whcih, I need to go to bed soon)
renayorama (1:02:44 AM): I don't like, SNAP EVERYONE'S HEADS OFF
renayorama (1:02:54 AM): Which is a good thing!
renayorama (1:03:57 AM): Oh, bed!
renayorama (1:03:59 AM): Yeah, bed.
zanydoodles (1:04:32 AM): well, happier!
zanydoodles (1:04:38 AM): that is an enormous achievement!
zanydoodles (1:05:34 AM): seriously.
renayorama (1:07:40 AM): Well, it makes me feel better
zanydoodles (1:08:16 AM): well, it makes me feel better too.
renayorama (1:08:27 AM): *cheered!*
zanydoodles (1:09:08 AM): happiness is a fine thing to achieve =)
renayorama (1:09:22 AM): Now, all I need to do is like, start writing my novel
zanydoodles (1:09:35 AM): XD
zanydoodles (1:09:40 AM): that would be good, yes XD
renayorama (1:09:39 AM): Oh hay
zanydoodles (1:10:03 AM): mm?
renayorama (1:10:04 AM): GLB is in the issue compiled by guy who thinks my writing sucks. >D
renayorama (1:10:07 AM): GLV
renayorama (1:10:09 AM): Sorry. >D
zanydoodles (1:10:20 AM): issue?
renayorama (1:10:32 AM): Of KH press
zanydoodles (1:11:04 AM): oh!
zanydoodles (1:11:07 AM): Amanda said she'dd add it tonight
zanydoodles (1:11:12 AM): I didn't know he was on staff!
renayorama (1:11:23 AM): Yes.
renayorama (1:11:30 AM): He is, he is
zanydoodles (1:11:56 AM): well. he still sucks.
renayorama (1:12:00 AM): Just a little,.
renayorama (1:12:06 AM): I try not to let it get to me, though
zanydoodles (1:12:22 AM): indeed. wise choice.
zanydoodles (1:12:30 AM): I saw Kim's comment by the way.
zanydoodles (1:12:36 AM): I was, um. a little appalled. what? ._.
zanydoodles (1:12:39 AM): is she okay?
renayorama (1:12:38 AM): No
renayorama (1:12:44 AM): She is a whiny baby who needs to grow up
renayorama (1:13:05 AM): I'm sorry I'm harsh about it, but really
renayorama (1:13:58 AM): Like, I had her comment pointed out to me when anon #1 commented to her and called her a jerk
zanydoodles (1:14:17 AM): anon#1?
renayorama (1:14:18 AM): And I was just like, "...I can't believe she's trying to make people feel guilty for not listing her."
renayorama (1:14:30 AM): Two people left anonymous comments to her comment
renayorama (1:14:36 AM): They weren't...polite
zanydoodles (1:15:10 AM): well, I guess Kim earned it. but still =(
renayorama (1:15:42 AM): No, it's sad.
renayorama (1:15:48 AM): But I don't know how to make her happy.
zanydoodles (1:15:53 AM): seriously, though, is she okay? besides an ebb in popularity (which, yes, she should get over), is there anything wrong in her life or anything?
renayorama (1:15:56 AM): Ginny
zanydoodles (1:16:02 AM): oh!
renayorama (1:16:01 AM): Her friend Ginny
zanydoodles (1:16:06 AM): is that her, u. the girl?
zanydoodles (1:16:13 AM): the younger girl, with the parents that suck?
renayorama (1:16:12 AM): prettygothgirl
renayorama (1:16:15 AM): No, that's Amy
renayorama (1:16:22 AM): Ginny found out Kim had a girlfriend
zanydoodles (1:16:26 AM): names ._.
renayorama (1:16:25 AM): And spazzed out
zanydoodles (1:16:32 AM): ... why?
renayorama (1:16:37 AM): Because SHE wanted to date Kim
renayorama (1:16:43 AM): She cut Kim off completely
zanydoodles (1:18:13 AM): wow